German Marines

[Barrett]

Forumites: can anybody shed some light on the question of a Kaiser's Marine Corps in WW I? There's some uncertainty whether the Marine Jastas were in fact navy units or belonged to a marine corps. Part of the confusion arises from the fact that the german word "marine" can mean "naval." One German source (currently unavailable to me) stated that the Freiwilligen Marine Flieger Korps was intended to support the Flanders Marine Korps's shore-based operations. It makes sense that an imperial power like Germany would have a marine corps, but I cannot find any evidence of same. So, to repeat: were the Marine Jastas actually navy units (as opposed to naval) or were they "Deutsche Teufelunden"?

[mike_baram]

Barrett,
The problem is that the term "Marine" for a soldier attached to naval units is an English term. In most foreign nations, the same mission would probably be assigned to "Kommando" units.
That's the problem when "marin(e)" means "navy" in Romance languages. (I think it's the same in German, but I'll leave the final word to German-speakers here.)
Mike

I' saw severa germanl P-3 Orion aircraft on our base at NAS Norfolk VA with MARINE very clear on the sides. in the second world war it was called the KREIGSMARINE I don't beleive germany ever had a Marine corps Although the do or did have as do most europen countries units of sailor trained as infantry called Naval Infanty

[mike_baram]

Phil,
I think the actual translation of "Kriegsmarine" is "war navy", or just "navy". We're still going to suffer whenever we have to figure out just what "marine" means in a foreign language.
(I remember when I was in the navy, and we had liberty in Santa Cruz de Tenerife, Canary Is. I was walking down one street in dress blues, some little kid looked at me and said "un marino"...with my limited Spanish I still understood that he meant "a sailor".)
Just in passing, the Israeli equivalent of marines is called "Kommando Yami" - sea commando.
And I don't think its strength is more than a couple of companies.
VBR
Mike

Kriegsmarine not Kreigsmarine

The two Seefrontstaffeln I and II formed to act as security for the MFA 2 floatplanes. There were also the Marinefeld Jasta ( MFJ I, MFJ II and MFJ III ) formed the JG Marine. In Sept 1918, MFJ IV and V joined the JG. They were under the command of Ltn zur See Gotthard Sachensberg and later renamed the Royal Prussian Marine Jagdgescwader.

Maybe Sachensberg's service can be tracked?

cam

forgot to add, what does " Deutsche Teufelunden " mean?

cam

[mike_baram]

Cam,
I think what Barrett meant was "Deutsche Teufelhundten". The Germans referred to the US Marines in WWI as "Teufelhundten" - "devil dogs" because of their ferocity in combat. Barrett was hinting at a German version, i.e. "German Devil Dogs".
Erich - correct me if I'm wrong, but my dim memories of German spelling rules are, as you indicated, - "ie" is pronounced "ee", and "ei" is pronounced "eye". Nicht wahr?
Mike

yes pronounciation of ie is like your ee for example in see and ei is pronounced as why or bye - the expression teufelshundten is absolutely strange to me could be translated as
devils dogs - but this would be written as Teufelshunde but have never heard of anyone
using this word. I have heard indeed of the word
´Teufelskerle´ which does mean Devils Blokes
or Devils-Fellows. Which is used to verbaly honor
a group of man which fullfilled the specific task.

Another word used in this sence is ´Höllenhunde´
which means ´Dogs of Hell´ - used for a group of man who wend through hell and are prepared to do it again.

so you see Teufelshunde is a mixture of both.
But I´ve never heard of anyone in Germany using
this word(Teufelshunde) Maybe someone got it from an american warmovie.

Its interesting what you can hear in some of them
when two germans soldiers are speaking together.
(every twenty seconds ´jawohl Herr Unteroffizier´ or other stuff of this kind)

In some movies the english or american soldiers
speak better german (syncronized into german)than
the germans (not syncronized)

The last movie i have seen was sgt ryan and a german died with the word ´fuba´ on his libs
well fuba means nothing in german (Fuba is a german electronic company - I can´t imagine
that an american is crying ´batteries included´
while dying on a battlefilled

by accidence i learned then in the internet on the homepage of an american-solicitor (a follower of the republican party - goodhavens!) that fuba is the abbriation of furchtbar
well furchtbar means horrible or terrible
and it is used in the same way as them
for instance what a horrible messwas eine
furchtbare Unordnung)

but i have never heard anyone shortening it to fuba
in no german slang or accent

Maybe its ´fubo´ which is the cry for father
and mother but not in german in japanese
Maybe someone had haerd this word on another
battlefield.

ok thats enought for today - i did know that i would continue talking without finding a end if someone would give me the possibility to do this -
be patience with me in getting answers from me I will answer them as soon as I can - but i am not verry often in the Internet - I am only connected via a Internet Cafe and i don t visit it every day.

by the way this site is fantastic - its a pity that they are not able to collect all the facts
supplied by the visitors and the users of the forum to actualize their Database - but its just to much -

bye the way I am looking for the name of a german
aviator who served in Tsingtau China at the beginning of the 1WW and fought against the Japanese. He was flying a Rumpler serving as gun-observer for the guns of the german garrison.

He was hiding the plane every day and replaced it on the airfield by a dummy wood-construction which was destroyed several times by japanese airplanes.

if you hear anything about this name pls. let me know - al the best and bye for now

[mike_baram]

Erich,
The use of the term "Devil Dogs" belongs to WWI, not to any other conflict, and is not even used in the US nowadays. Just part of the history of the USMC, one of the many names that have been applied to them at one time or another (along with "leathernecks", "gyrenes", "jarheads"....not all of those terms are complimentary, I must add.)
So, unless you know any old German soldiers, I doubt if the term has any relevance in today's Germany.
FUBAR is an acronym....F***ed Up Beyond All Recognition.....and I never knew of its existence until I saw "Pvt. Ryan"...I did know SNAFU...."Situation Normal, All F***ed UP".
Hope this clears up any confusion.
Auf Wiedersehen,
Mike