Is it just me.....

Is it just me, or has the atmosphere on the forum taken a turn for the nasty. I have just seen Mannock, described as a jerk, and I hoped he burned all the way down, mind you they where the same people who complained when MvR was being accused of being more than a "gentleman of the air". Let me say these are our opinions, but thats all they are opinions. Let us not vilify one another because of our beliefs. From Al to Rittm, we all share one thing, respect and a fascination of those brave men that flew in WW1.

So lets lighten up on one another, bloody hell it's nearly Christmas, the time for peace and forgiving.

The reason I got interested in this forum was for the open, yes open minds that you all have, so when someone like Jim "Ace" has an opinion, or Barrett, or even you Jeni (MvR would be so dissapointed in you ), lets not attack them personally, or even take their opinions as a personal attack, thats not what they are, even I attacked a poor lad called Captain when he said that Bishop was a Bulls...er, I should have been more objective. LETS LIGHTEN UP!!!

Anyway Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukka and what ever other festival is being celebrated at this time in the world. (It was so much easier before PC)

Andrew Smith.

[Rittm]

You do have a good point there. Even during the early part of WWI, the ground troops stopped fighting for a while to celebrate Christmas. I think I read that the Germans were heard sining Christmas songs.

Rittm

Andrew,
It's not just you, for I noticed it too. It seems to be okay to call the one ace an awesome dude, and the other aces on the allied side a bunch of prevaricating, rude jerks. I guess all of those who are so down on the allies should realize that maybe the anti-German sentiment ran high among the Allies because of the nasty things that the German's had done in WW1. It was they after all that introduced gas warfare during that war. They invented Mustard Gas, (this is where it gets personal as my great Uncle died as a result of being caught in a mustard gas attack in France during the first world war.) No he didn't die right away, it took him 5 years of horrible suffering to die because his lungs had been blistered. Anyway the point they all seem to miss is that war de-humanizes each of it's participants. If you villify the enemy (make him less than human) then it makes him easier to kill and you don't suffer an attack of consciense too badly. If he is the nicest guy around, nobody would want to kill him. But as for open mindedness, I couldn't agree more. Yes indeed, these folks need to lighten up. The only prick around here is me Ha-Ha!!! Mick Mannock was a good pilot and his hatred made him sharp. But he too committed the fatal error in not keeping situational awareness. By the way Andrew, Merry Christmas and write to me at my e-mail address.
VBR,
Jim

P.S. For everyone else out there, when you think you've got things bad, just remember that on Christmas Day I'll be somewhere in the middle of the Pacific Ocean away from my wife whom I love most dearly. Think about that and maybe your situation won't seem too bad after all.
Check Six!!!

[Rittm]

As I am one of the evil Germans, I need to point this out to you my dear Jim, I don't think the point of this post was to start an argument. I think the idea was to spread good cheer. Do you have a lot of argumentative people around you? You need to relax and take a hot bath. Ask your wife for a back rub or go out and have a romantic dinner with her. I just can't help but to feel that you are missing something.

Andrew,
Did I miss the point of the post? Anybody for a friendly snowball fight?

Rittm

Is it must my server or is there a cyber "echo" on this thread?
Is it just my server or is there a cyber "echo" on this thread?
Jim--lighten up, dude. If you're in the middle of the ocean on holidays, it's because you choose to be there. Right? Us USAF guys were always getting beat up on by navy and marine types because some of us complained about "long" deployments of three or four months and you guys are gone for six months. Fair enough, but
remember: "The navy, it's not just a job, it's an adventure."

Fellows,
I don't think the German people are evil as I am of German descent on my Mother's side. I was trying to explain why people during wartime... hate. Also how hatred makes a balm for their own conscience. As far as my being on cruise goes, yes it was my choice, but I was just trying to tell these guys and gals that things could always be worse. The first message didn't miss the point of the start of the thread. It was mis-interpeted, hence this clarification. Are we all singing from the same sheet of music yet? Can I get an amen! There is so much love flowing around here... GEE... how about let's all sing Kumbaya!
Cheerio,
Jim

Jim, did you get my e-mail?

Regards,
Andrew

[Reinout]

Dear all,

I even recall that in 1914 or 1915 (maybe both) German and Allied groundsluggers got together during a Christmas cease-fire and celebrated! I may even have a picture of it in Peter Simkins' book:"WWI: The Westfront" which isn't such a good book by the way.
As for the Forum turning nasty, well I don't think we're in such a sorry plight (yet). I know some harsh things have been said, but I also know that the authors didn't intend any personal harm. And none was taken, as far as I am concerned. It is just that some of the issues we have are of such stature that they need some tough discussing. But when everything is said and the day is done, do you take a grudge home? I know I don't. I certainly think about what has been said, and try to find new arguments, new facts, new clues etc. on the subject; not its author. As a matter of fact, I only slept 5 hours last night because I spent almost 2 hours lying in bed thinking about the Luke issue, the current MvR-threads and the guilt-question of WWI as well as some WWII topics that aren't related.
Isn't that what this Forum is all about? I believe that is exactly what mr. Scott Hamilton had in mind when he included the Forum.

Well, enough said, I've got some threads to report on!

Kind regards and have a merry Saint Nicholas,

Reinout

Reinout,
I think what you say about the subjects of the forum are valid, what I don't agree with is the personal comments some people have made, even if they are meant to be light hearted.

I think the forum is for educated discussion not vilification. It is not that I can't defend myself, because if I have to I will, but that is not what this forum is all about. I don't think it good form when someone calls an Ace a PR..K! That is uneducated and uncalled for. I don't care which aces you support or idolise, these men fought for and laid down their lives for us, they are not Pri..s! Sometimes I get my Irish up over things that others seem less important but if you can accept someone calling someone else a Pr..k or saying they deserved to die, then Reinout I have misjudged you. Scott please do not edit this, as I think it is important that people know that Mannock was called a Pr..k and not a Jerk!

As for Christmas on the Western Front, I have actually seen a photo of them playing soccer.

Regards,
Andrew.

[Reinout]

Dear Andrew,

You have not misjudged me! I don't recall seeing the word "pr..k" in correspondence with an ace. I did see "rank amateur" and "jerk" which I find equally insulting. You are correct in stating that such remarks were not meant for this Forum. I hope I haven't given you the wrong impression. In fact, if you look at the pieces I wrote, you will know that I have always kept respect for the subject. Even when I asked critical questions I did not lose sight of their accomplishments and the purpose of this Forum.

Kind regards,

Reinout