How Those Bad Allies Made Germany Invade Poland in 1939

[stephen]

AAAUUUUGGGH! I tried to stop myself from creating this thread but I couldn't. It was mentioned in another thread that the Allies caused WWII by their harsh treatment of Germany after WWI. Is this the popular opinion now, or am I out of my mind? The Allies were responsible for WWII in much the same way as Ken Starr is responsible for Bill Clinton's perjuring himself, or the same way that a beautiful woman is responsible for getting herself raped. Would it have happened without them? Of course not, but they're certainly not responsible by default for the criminal actions of others. Using that logic, wouldn't the Germans then be responsible for starting the war that resulted in the Allies creating a treaty which started the next war? Oh, wait... I've got it. Gavrilo Princip's mother is responsible for WWII because she failed to properly raise her son who started the Serbian mess which caused Germany to invade Belgium which led to a really mean treaty which caused the Polish border to look too tempting to pass up for Adolf Hitler who would never have been put in power by the German people if it weren't for some other really mean person. Will somebody throw me a frickin' bone here? AAARRRRGGGH!

Whew. Sorry 'bout that. I do feel better now. Thank you.

[rammjaeger]

Oh Stephen,

come down again. At first you should know I do not think in monocausal structures. The WW II was caused by a lot of different reasons and I have not the intend to refuse the German responsibility for this war. Additional there is NO reason which could justify the German war crimes.

BUT only an IGNORANT could believe that these treaties of Versailles did not create the bottom for the revenge war and also supported the Hitler propaganda.

The Germans took away French area (which was German before) in 1871 - the result: The French started to search for a revenge war as well. The Brits had the intend to get rid of the powerful German competitor - that is the real reason for the UK stepping in the war. The British government did never bother about neutrality if British troops were violating the human rights during colonial and other wars in other parts of the world!

Yes, the German Empire was the most aggressive state during the start of the century - but only the first among equals!
I repeat - more precise this time - Versailles was one(!)basic reason for World War II (some important allied marshalls and generals said the same).

It was a peace made by (colonial) robbers against another robber - so nobody could expect a fair treatment or deeper thinking about the future of mankind.

Ah, Thank you for the clarification.

Stephen, You are almost correct but have left out the obvious. The fault does not lay with Princip, but rather with the parents of one Franz Ferdinand, whose physiological gratifications one day in the 1870's was responsible for the second war.

[Stephanie]

Well met, Hannes! Es freut mich wirklich, einen Deutschen zu begenen, der so intelligent ist, und kann mit solchem Rücksicht Alles erklären!

Stephen, I cannot believe you have submitted such a thing.

[Stephanie]

One more time. Stephen, to answer your question: no, it was not the fault of the Allies. It was the Swedes and the Hapsburgs and the French. If they had not scoured and pillaged and destroyed Germany and its culture in the Thirty Years War, none of this would have happened. Correction: if Martin Luther had not made it possible for the precipitation of cuius regio eius religio, there would not have been a cause for the Thirty Years War.....If the Holy Father had exerted more self control and discipline over his see, Martin would never have caused such a row.......If there had been no reason for Electors, but one centralised monarchy in the Holy Roman Empire......If Charles the Bald had raised his sons properly so that they would not have fought over the Western and Eastern Franconian Empire.....If the Roman Legions had had a better and more tactical leader than old Varus........No, I blame it on the parents.

[mike_baram]

And if Pharoah's daughter had ignored the basket with the baby, there would have been no Exodus into the promised land, usurping the Canaanites, and no Kingdom of Judea, and no cult arising out of the teachings of Jesus which displaced Mithraism, and no .......yadayadayada, and no German soldiers wearing belt buckles inscribed with "Gott Mit Uns".....
I always knew that offing the dinosaurs would result in problems, but no one listens to me.

[Rittm]

Oh I couldn't resist this one.
First of all Germany did not start WWI. The Serbs murdered an Austrian Duke. It was an incident that should have been handled by Austria and Serbia. It was an internal problem in the old Empire of the Habsburg. Second, the Russians had been sniffing around the borders of Germany for quite sometime rousing uncomfortable feelings with the Germans. The Russians also had some kind of beef with old Franz Joseph, so the minute those troublesome Russians got the Serbs to cause trouble and do something stupid, this was their opportunity to stick their nose into the that region of Austro-Hungary Empire. Everyone had been slowly chewing off chunks of the old empire including the Germans who did it back in the 1860s or 1870s? Third, the Germans gave their support to their relative and were concerned about the Russians and their troop movements that were going on BEFORE the war started. So the Germans being worried naturally assumed that the Russians were going to pounce. Wouldn't you think someone was going to hit you if they were holding a big stick over your head? Then of course the stupid French had to stick their nose into everything. (Sometimes I think the French were put on this planet to annoy the rest of us.) Poor Belgium was not a target and they unfortunately were the country's who's yard was the best short cut. The Germans did NOT start WWI and the Allies in their greed was responsible for laying the foundation for WWII. They asked for it on a silver platter. I strongly feel that the poor Jews (who seem to always get kicked around) and the Germans are the true victums of WWII. The Jews and other folks being inncocently slaughtered and the poor Germans falling from grace by being mesmerized by a crazed nut that should have kept to painting. The Germans are still paying for that war and paying and paying. I'm getting real sick of Germans and Nazis being equated as the same thing. I am of German blood now and I was then during the First World War. World War II should have NEVER have happened. I hate what the Nazis have done to the reputation and self worth of the German people. If I had lived I would have been the first one to take a nasty weapon to Hermann Göring, Adolf, and the rest of the crew!

Read the book Victory Must Be Ours for a less emotional response to the foundations of WWI.

Ahhh. Boy that felt good to get off my chest.
Rittm

[Rittm]

Geez, I should have read the other responses first. I feel more calm. That whole treaty thing is a real sore spot with me. Of course, I'm still pissed of at the French for murdering Marie Anntoinette. Just one more day.

Rumor has it that Einstein first envisioned his theory of relativity in a drunken stupor, while in bed with a cousin, hence the name. How's that Michael?