Red Baron's nobility

Can anyone verify if von Richthofen's family name derifed from the surname Praetorius. There was a short mentioning of this in the book "Richthofen the Red Knight of the Air" page 12 by Vigilant first published in 1934 and then reprinted in 1967?

Thanks
Gert

Gert-

Have you ever read Kilduff's book "Richthofen: Beyond the Legend of the Red Baron"? In Chapter Two, Kilduff discusses Richthofen's lineage. Indeed it makes referance to a Mr. Paulus Praetorius and his adopted son, Samuel in 1565. It goes on to speak about Samuel's son Tobias and Tobias' son Johann (1611-1664). Johann was inducted into the Bohemian knighthood and granted the honorary surname: Richt-Hofen. Gert, I think you've got some serious links here. By the way, Richt-Hofen means 'Court of Judgement', in case you were intrested. Hans

[mike_baram]

Wow! For a duffer in the burgeoning field of arcane etymology, that info on the source of the name "Richthofen" is really interesting. This forum is a veritable living encyclopædia. Thanks, all.
Mike
"I gotta get off of this %#$@**%# beach."
(Any GI at Omaha Beach - June 6, 1944)

Hans was right, but just a little more information.

Paulus Praetorius was not his real name. As Paulus was a judge, a position he devoted himself to, he took the final step by changing his name to Praetorius, to which Hans has supplied a translation. Paulus' real name was Paulus Schultze or Schultheiss.

Again Hans got it right in recommending a great book, "Richthofen Beyond the Legend of the Red Baron" by Kilduff.

Regards,
Andrew Smith.

Thanks for all the info!!

I am determined not to miss this opportunity to finaly get this right, and clearly we have a couple of people here who know what they are talking about.
Is it then the case that a) This is an hireditary Knight rather than a Barron?
B) As MvR did not succeed his father is his title more like
"the Right Honorable"?

I have long held that this is the case and it would be good to have it confirmed by someone who is clearly so well informed.
Of course MvR will still me the Red Barron to me and everybody else. "The Red Right Honorable" doesn't have the same ring somehow.

thanks for a vey informative thread

Peter

[Vigilant]

You mean just "the honourable...".
"Right Honourable" is the title given to members of parliament!

Duhh! goofed again. But you know what I meen. And anyway I do the pedantry around here.

Peter

If I remember correctly (standard hedging statement) in Germany hereditary titles are carried by all male members of the family even before the father dies, thus:

Albrecht (Father)
Manfred
Lothar
& Bolko Could all be legitmately referred to as 'Baron von Richthofen' even while the old man was still alive..unlike the British method, where George Gordon only became 'Lord Byron' upon the death of his father...jeez, in that case barons and counts must multiply like rabbits in Germany hehe. I know for a fact this was the case in Russia, where if you shook a Russian birch tree, a couple of drunk princes were likely to fall out.

MDD

Peter,
As far as I know MvR was entitled to be called a Baron, I will give you a quick run down of his family tree.
Paulus had no sons so he adopted a Pastors son and his name was Samuel. Now Paulus died when Samuel was 22(1561) and he inherited all Paulus' land and wealth as well asa seat on the Richterschul(?) I think its english translation means tribunal. He had a son named Tobias who bought a lot of property in Silesia. Tobias had a son named Johann who in 1661 was promoted to the title of Bohemian Knight under the name of Johann Praetorius von Richthofen. By the middle of the 17th century the family had settled in Silesia and where great supporters of King Friedrich II. As a reward the monarch promoted the family to the baronial ranks and gave the male members the right to be called Freiherr(could one of our German speaking friends translate please.)This title was hereditary.

I hope this solves your question.
Regards,
Andrew Smith.