Fighter aces' new career directions

It's November 11 1918, you're an ace, and you've survived the war, but what next? What happened to the aces after the war? Which pilots became barnstormers like Waldo Pepper in the film? Obviously Goering and Udet got up to no good with the Nazis (although the bumbling ineptitude of both did the allies an immense favour), but did any go on to outstanding achievements in other fields? Did any match the misfortune of Rudolph Berthold, strangled with his own medal ribbons? Who was the best self-publicist and did any make it to Hollywood?

[Amy]

Eddie:

Well, you obviously haven't read Udet's autobiography "Ace of the Black Cross" (am I the only one who's read anybody's auto/biographies around here?) I definitely recommend it as it's an excellent book. Udet briefly was in the aircraft company business as his partners used the notoriety of his name after the war for the business, he flew barnstorming performances all over the world, and made a stop in Hollywood as well as appearing in three German films. Udet and Rickenbacker even met at one of Udet's flying performances while in the U.S. (Udet spoke fluent English, by the way). Udet led quite an exciting life after the war. The only other ace with such an eventful life as Udet's that immediately comes to mind is Eddie Rickenbacker himself. I'll let someone else fill you in on Rickenbacker.

Amy

[Vigilant]

Charlie Nungesser can't have been a bad self-publicist. He attempted the Atlantic non-stop in a single-engined plane in 1927. Unfortunately he never made it.

A number of ex-wartime pilots worked as stunt flyers in Hollywood, but so far as I've been able to learn none of the big aces even visited, save perhaps for Nungesser while promoting his non-Hollywood film (now lost) in, I think, 1925.

A lot of fighter pilots had trouble adjusting to the slower pace of civilian life after the war. Pegoud, I think, went mad, then killed himself practising for a stunt that would have seen him fly under the Arc de Triomphe. Barker also died foolishly stunting; Bishop became a heavy drinker and something of a genius for failing in business (fortunately, he married money). Of course, we only hear about the ones who had trouble. No doubt others readjusted quite nicely ( Gwilym Lewis and Cecil Lewis come to mind).

[Amy]

P.S. Apparently Udet did some stunt flying in Hollywood as well although I don't know exactly what picture(s) he flew in, if any. In the movie you mentioned, "The Great Waldo Pepper", the character of Kessler is based upon Udet. If you watch the opening credits carefully, they show one of Udet's old WWI postcard pictures. One of the Fox executives asked Udet about making a movie on Richthofen. Udet replied that it couldn't be done.

I know that Raymond Collishaw, saw some more actionover Russia after WW1, and in WW2 he was (My mind isn't working now) in charge of some air operations over Malta. They called the Hurricanes there "Collies Battleships". Of course he isn't well known to some since he was a Canadian flying for the Royal Naval Air Service.

I also heard that Edward Ritkenbacker during WW2 was in an aircraft of sorts, flying into the Pacific. It crashed (I don't know if it was shot down or what) and him and the young crew were adript for many days. They were all ready to die, but he inspired them to live and he threatened to beat the tar out of them if they died. He was a hero again.

I also heard that Udet didn't agree with Nazi policy and his "suicide" wasn't what it really seemed. I beleive that the concept of dive bombing was his idea.

VBR
Naval 10

[Reinout]

Michael Skeet,

It wasn't Pegoud, but Jean Navarre. He wanted to shine on the victory parade in 1919 by flying underneath the Arc de Triomphe, but got killed when practising flying underneath telephone cables. He went mad during 1916 and wasn't returned to duty in 1918, but he didn't see any action anymore.

All,

If you look at the amount of PlM fliers who were killed during the Interbellum, there's no surprise that not too many became famous during that period. From memory, I think that of the 33 or so fighter pilots that survived, only 20 were alive to witness WWII.

Kind regards,

Reinout

In looking at various sources, I was very surprised at the number of (German) flyers who died in either flying or traffic accidents, including Lothar v. R. and Kurt Wusthoff. There were many other flyers who died in accidents of one sort or another. I guess manyof them couldn't supress the "need for speed!"

[Barrett]

I have an unpublished article with Flight Journal called "After They Were Aces." EVR certainly was successful, and probably would have been even had he not gone into aviation, as he was already well known automotively. My favorite among the postwar aces is Gerhard Fieseler, who not only was one of the top two German scorers in the Macedonian League, but was a superb aerobatic pilot, winning five championships. He also founded his own company which built the fabulous Storch STOL bird and V-1 airframes!
Many of the survivors faded into obscurity, most notably Fonck, against whom collaboration charges reportedly were lodged following WW II. We had a thread on that subject last year but evidently nobody knows fershure what happened. I suspect that perhaps his interwar acquaintance with Goering was held against him.
Collishaw commanded the Desert Air Force in North Africa and, according to two sources who were there, was not widely admired. Seems his boys incurred heavy losses at the hands of H-J Marseille Gmbh, though certainly Collie had paid his dues by surviving 1917 himself as a junior officer!

Naval 10,
The concept of dive bombing was formulated and brought into use by the U.S.M.C. for close air support operations in the 20's and early 30's. It was first used in Nicaragua during the "Banana Wars". I think the Germans got the idea from watching the Marine Corps aviators show their skills during an air power demonstration which took place sometime in the mid to late 30's. I'm not exactly sure on the dates, but I am sure of the authors of the concept of dive bombing.
VBR,
Jim
VBR,
Jim