Fokker D.VIII (not D.VII)

Were there any aces who flew the Fokker 8? And did they score any kills with it?

Jasta 6 was the first unit (possibly the only?)to receive the E5/D8. I believe that several of its pilots scored in the D8, including Neckel, Noltenius and Wenzl.

[leo]

Didn't Theo Osterkampf claim a kill or two on the DVIII?

Yes, Osterkamp did. Some more Marine-Feldjasta pilots flew D-VIII/E-V successfully. Besides them also Jasta 24 (Friedrich Altemeier)is known to have flown D-VIII/E-V in combat.

Mosen

According to Peter Grosz in the Windsock Datafile, only ONE victory for the EV/DVIII has been confirmed - Ltn Emil Rolf of Jasta 6 on 17 August 1918.

He states in a footnote that Osterkamp did not achieve victories 25 and 26 with the DVIII, as others have stated. In his biography, it is said he did not fly the EV much because it was "too slow" to keep with the squadron's DVII's. During a solitary EV familiarization flight, he was jumped by three Spads and forced to bail out.

Rich

The pilot with the one EV/DVIII victory was Ltn. Emil Rolff (I misspelled it before). Two days later, 19 August, he fell victim to wing failure.

Rich

[Dan_San_Abbott]

I wish to offer a piece of information. The Fokker Works began deliveries of the Fokker E.V on 3 July 1918. The Fokker E.V was delivered to Jasta 6,19,24,36 and the 1,2, and 3MFJ in early August 1918 and were grounded from service about 23 August 1918 after two deaths resulting from wing failures. No Fokker D.VIII were ever issued in August 1918. Deliveries from the Fokker factory began on 8 October 1918 the Fokker E.V was returned to service and it's designation was changed to D.VIII. It is not known to this researcher if any were reissued prior to the end of the war. The deliveries to the the Armee Flugpark (Afp)in the 4.,2.,18.,and 7. Armeen took about 10 to 14 days from the factory. Deliveries to all Jasta occured between the first and 2nd weeks of August 1918. All victories scored pilots flying the Fokker E.V occured between 6 and 20 August 1918.
Dan-San Abbott

Dan-San,

I was careless in casually tossing around the "EV/DVIII" designations in my reply, and I should be more careful, since I DO know the difference. I still have a 1969 article about Ed Swearingen's replica, built with help from Reinhold Platz. It was done in my home town at the time, and our family doctor helped Ed with translation. DVIII does seem to be the more "popular", better known, name to most people. I recently commented on a new "historical flavor" article on the Modeling Madness site, which was horribly flawed (April 1916...Pups, Camels, MvR, etc.). I was taken to task for "nitpicking" the "artical".

On the subject at hand, I did report Mr. Grosz's statements accurately. It appears, in spite of its reputaion as the "cat's whiskers" among WWI aircraft, that the Flying Razor was pretty much a bust in combat. After sparring with Mr. Revell, and Mr. Imrie, I hope you're not going to tell me Peter Grosz is also wrong...if you folks continue to argue about virtually everything, what are the rest of us poor amateurs supposed to believe?

Rich

[Craig]

Regarding the assertion that the D.VIII was "pretty much a bust in combat":

I'll not argue with Mr. Grosz (even in absentia). But I don't believe that the Germans recorded who was flying what when they shot down whomever - or at least the surviving records don't include this info. Point is, there may have been more D.VIII victories, but we don't know because the type of a/c used to accomplish this wasn't recorded.

The limitations imposed on the type: wing failure due to shoddy workmanship, lack of castor oil, and the Armistice, limited the planes's success. I read an account from an SE5a pilot who, after encountering the D.VIII in combat for the first time, said something along the lines of 'it toyed with us', and that 1919 might well turn out to be 'another 1915'. Sorry; I can't recall where I read this at the moment.

Interestingly, in 1917 MvR was very displeased with the "new" Albatros D.V, and made a similar comment to the SE5a pilot's first remark - the Camel and SE5 pilots "could play with us" in the D.V.

Craig

[Dan_San_Abbott]

Rich:
My reply was not directed to you rich, but a general response to show the difference between the Fokker E.V and D.VIII. Actually D.VIII is a nisnomer, D.stand for armed biplane. What should have been done was to redesignate the E.V to E.Va with the new wing. The Fok.E.V with the Oberursel Ur.II 120Ps engine was moderate performance. With the Ur.III 150Ps engine the performance would have been very good, but that would have been early 1919.
blue skies Dan-San