GERMAN PILOT IN REVOLUTIONARY MEXICO, 1916

hi; does anybody know something about a german pilot named R. SCHWIERZ?. He identifyied himself as a "German navy pilot" and claimed to have fought the japanese at Tsientsin, in China in late 1914: this person reappeared in northern México in early 1916, and offered his service as a pilot for the mexican revolutionaries, complete with his Rumpler Taube.

Many thanks
Miguel

[rammjaeger]

There were only two German pilots flying over Tsientsin (Tsingtau, Tsingtao etc.) in late 1914. Lieutenant Müllerskowski was severly injured in a crash with his Rumplert-Taube. Therefore Gunther Plüschow was the single German pilot during the time of the Japanese siege. I believed I have seen a man with name Schwierz among the German pre-war fliers but could not find prove during the check of the Civil licences and (incomplete) Military training flight schedules until now.

thanks for your response; I understand that Pluschow survived the conflict at Tientsin and left China to eventually reach the American west coast via San Diego, this is very close to the mexican border, and dates basically match; can it be that Pluschow and Schwierz can be the same person? From the documents I have, this german was almost centainly a real pilot, as he described in detail the Taube and its engine. Other possibility is that this was a german pilot caught in transit to China during the military debacle over there.
In any case, it appears that a second man, identifyed as Schwierz´s mechanic, actually flew the Taube across the border, only to destroy it in transit to Sonora; Schwierz was actually captured by american border patrols, escaped, crossed the border by foot, and eventually was received by the revolutionaries, serving as an artillery instructor. What do you think?

best regards
Miguel

Hello Miguel and Hannes,

During the years of the Mexican Revolution, my great-grandfather sold guns (primarily small arms)
in Mexico. Villa and Carranza were two of his customers.

Being of German heritage but growing up on the American frontier, he spoke 3 languages(the third being Spanish). He often talked about meeting Germans in Mexico, presumably mercenaries though he claimed some were there by orders of the German government.

Many of the arms used by all sides in the con-flict were of German origin. Though he never saw one, he heard of German aircraft in Mexico during those times.

I have never seen any research regarding German involvement in Mexico during these years, but it was the interception of the Zimmermann Telegram (with its Mexican connection)that finally got America into WW1. Perhaps you know more...

Best Wishes,
Gary

hi all; for those interested in German intrigue in Mexico during the revolutionary years, the book "Katz, Friedrich; La Guerra Secreta en México" is a classic; of course, Katz is of german origin, but i don´t know if this fine piece of research has been traslated; if someone needs a Spanish language copy, just let me know.

Best regards
Miguel.

[rammjaeger]

Miguel,

Plüschow is not the same as this pilot Schwierz because Plüschow came to America already in January 1915 and left soon. Additional he had no means, no money or support for an adventure in Mexico. Finally he did not report such an activity in his book about his escape from China. Some other men including the German observer Killinger escaped from Sibiria and travelled to America as well. But they had the same problems as Plüschow. Therefore I think Gary is right. There lived, worked or studied a lot of Germans in the USA before the war and some were maybe moving to Mexico (or were ordered to go to Mexico?) later.

Regards

Hannes

Hello All,

The recent thread regarding Carl Degelow's PLM reminded me that he was in America prior to WW1 and spent some time in El Paso, Texas (on the border with Mexico). Did he have any Mexican "adventures"?

During this time, the entire US/Mexico border from California to Texas was (and much of it still is) a wild, unsettled frontier. There were many foreigners (including Americans) who fought for various causes in Mexico during those times.

I suspect the German Foreign office may have gotten some erroneous information about the strength or sophistication of the US from some people whose only experience in the US was in these border areas. Hence the absurd ideas of the Zimmermann Telegram.

Prior to America's entry into WW1, John J. Pershing led an American military expedition into Mexican Territory to defeat or capture Pancho Villa. Another member of that expedition was George Patton. Pershing was not successful and returned to the US empty-handed.

A fascinating but little-known time in history. There are probably many hidden stories there waiting to be discovered.

Best Wishes,
Gary

Dear Gary,

You're right, Pershing wasn't very succesfull in his Mexico campaign, but Patton had a beautifull succes. Being a lt. at the time, he took three Dodge touringcars went into Mexico looking for General Julio Cardenas, one of Villa's most important men. They first went to the San Miguelito ranch were Cardenas wife lived and then went on to Saltillo ranch of Cardenas uncle. Then they returned and Patton finally found Cardenas who tried to get away with two men. Patton himself killed one of them and wounded Cardenas, who was then shot dead by one of the drivers of Patton. He brought the three dead bodies to general Pershing, and made two notches in the handle of his Peacemaker.
Later he went to France to serve with the tanks. First he hated them, then he fell in love with them. The result was shown in WW II.
I know it has nothing to do with flying, but I loved reading this story over and over again. Sorry all !
Johan

Dear Johan,

Thanks for your interesting story about Patton's adventures. He always loved a fight even in his early days it seems. The only thing he couldn't conquer was his mouth, but lots of people have that problem. At least he matched his big talk with big actions.

Best Wishes,
Gary