Guynemer and Freiherr von Hausen

[rammjaeger]

I was reading Georges Guynemer was shooting down Freiherr von Hausen of Jasta 32 in a battle on 16th march 1917. Von Hausen survived only to die later in a hospital in Toul on 17.May 1917 (other source claims 17.July).

I would like to know which victory (number 20, 30 ...) was von Hausen for Guynemer?

I believe to remember that Guynemer visited Lt. von Hausen in the hospital but can not find the source. Who has seen a report about a meeting between both?

Thanks.

VBR

Hannes

[leo]

"Jasta Pilots" claims he was shot down probably by GG on March 16, 1917 northof Hoeville and was the first casualty of Jasta 32. They occupied two fields during March, Destrich-Brulingen and also Chery-les-Pouilly. He was taken prisoner and died of his wounds in hospital onJuly, 15, 1917 at the age of 23.

leo

[Cliff]

According to 'Guynemer Les Avions D'un As' von Hausen was Guynemer's 33rd victory.
This book has four nice pics of v. Hausen's Roland D.II

Cliff

Dear Hannes,

This is an extract of the 16 March 1917 "Résumé des opérations aériennes" of Groupe de Combat 12 (The Storks) :

(...) AVIONS ABATTUS. - Cinq avions allemands ont été abattus aujourd'hui, dans nos lignes.
Le capitaine GUYNEMER de la N.3, en a abattu 3.
Le 1er, un biplace, est tombé en flammes dans nos lignes à 9h 08 à la Ferme de FOUCREY, près du village de SERRES.
Le 2°, un monoplace Rolland, a été abattu, à 9h 30, et a atterri dans nos lignes, au Nord d'HOEVILLE ; le pilote blessé à la jambe a été fait prisonnier.
Le 3°, un biplace, est tombé en flammes, dans nos lignes, à 14h 37, à REGNIEVILLE-EN-HAYE, 32°, 33°, et 34° avions abattus par le capitaine GUYNEMER. (...)

Sorry, that's in French ! I'm not a good traductor... I must add that many pics of von Hausen's plane exist.

VBR,
Christophe

[rammjaeger]

Many thanks to Leo, Cliff and Christophe!

Jasta 32 lost von Hausen (9.25 a.m.)- son and nephew of Saxon Generals - and squadron leader Oblt. Schwandner (9.30 a.m., dead) this day. The loss list of Jasta 32 says von Hausen was fighting against 2 Nieuports and Schwandner against 2 other aircraft too. A Saxon source reports von Hausens death and says the counterparts were Guynemer and three other French aircraft.

Cony, do French sources mention the other French pilots and the number of involved German oneseaters?

[rammjaeger]

The shotdowns occured 10.25 and 10.30 a.m. German time, I guess that is the same as 9.25 and 9.30 French time.

[Soderbaum]

Hi Hannes

I have a note that Capt Albert Deullin of Esc 77 shot down a German 1-s within french lines at Einville en Haye.
Time 9:31
This was his 12 victory and it was perhaps Oblt Schwandner the commander of Jasta 32.

What was Lothar doing in a Bavarian unit..?

VBR
Gunnar

[rammjaeger]

Gunnar,

the unit became a Bavarian unit in July 1917 not earlier! Also other units were transformed with the order of the 17th July.

The newcomer fighter pilots von Hausen (1 victory) and Schwandner (0?) vs Guynemer (32) and Deullin (11). The weak-performing Roland "Haifisch" against maneuvrable Nieuports. Easy to predict the result against the French aces!


PS: It is maybe easier to convert Prussians (or Saxons) into Bavarians than reversed!

[Soderbaum]

Hi Hannes

I agree that both von Hausen and Schwandner were new as fighter pilots, but at least Schwander was an experiend pilot...in 1916 he served as a commander of the "Bavarian" KG 6 Staffel 36....its even a small possiblity that he is the Oblt Schwandtner who served in the "Saxon" FFA 24 early 1916...? but thats a guess..

There was a Heinrich Schwandner who took the pilot license DLV nr 470 before the War...!

I either dont know if Schwandner had any victories..perhaps Frank Olynyk have that kind of information..?

Do you knew in what unit Lt von Hausen scored his first victory..?

Thankyou for the information about Jasta 32..I "missed" that.

VBR
Gunnar

[rammjaeger]

Hi Gunnar,

I think Schwandner´s short biography is in the Potempa-book too. I check that later. It could clarify the licence and victories as well.

Von Hausen was shooting down (together with Oblt. Heymann, former member of Husaren-Regiment 18) a French two-engined Caudron on 8.March 1916. During this time he was serving in the Verdun area. Source: "Sachsen in großer Zeit", page 324, nearly one A4-page, inc. one photo, is written about von Hausen there).

You will get more info about J32 soon but I had to bring my father into the hospital last night because of trouble with the heart and did not have already opportunity to copy the promised Beck-pages for you.

VBR

Hannes