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| 2001 Closed threads from 2001 (read only) |
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20 December 2001, 09:47 AM
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#1 (permalink)
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Forum Ace of Aces
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: The American West
Posts: 4,613
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Has there ever been an authoritative English volume on the Freikorps c. 1918-21 or thereabouts? I note that Osprey recently released Jurado's volume in the Men At Arms (or maybe Elite) series and I'll probably order it but just wonder what else might be out there. Nothing else turns up on the net.
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22 December 2001, 11:02 PM
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#2 (permalink)
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Forum Ace
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Lansing, MI USA
Posts: 2,560
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FYI, I've been looking too, but have yet to find anything.
VBR,
Al
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Al Lowe
The Billy Bishop Zone
The posession of arms is the distinction between a Freeman and a slave.
- MP Andrew Fletcher, 1698
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23 December 2001, 05:26 AM
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#3 (permalink)
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Forum Ace
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,857
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I have a book in my library. "Hitler's Heralds,The story of the Freikorps 1918-1923",Nigel H Jones, Dorset Press , NYC, 1992 ISBN 0-88029-963-0. Jones also wrote two books about WWI, "The War Walk: A Journey Along The Western Front" and "Messines:
The Forgotten Victory.
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23 December 2001, 12:19 PM
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#4 (permalink)
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Forum Ace of Aces
Join Date: Aug 1998
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Thanks so much, Leo. Among other things, I'm interested in looking up more of Berthold's activities; I assume he'd be mentioned.
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24 December 2001, 04:28 AM
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#5 (permalink)
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Forum Ace
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
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Yes, he is mentioned as Commander of the Eiserne Schar, the most powerful of ther Freikorps and of his luke warm support of the Kapp Putsch.
He decided to march with the Putch in Berlin via Hamburg. His way was hindered by striking railwaymen. They reached Harburg and decided to stay the night in a school.
The circumstances of his death in Harburg are also covered. He was besieged by Reds in a school. After a bitter fight,and using up all his ammo. he was forced to surrender, he was strangled with his Pour le Merite medal ribbon, decapitated, his body stomped into Jelly, and left in a gutter..
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25 December 2001, 10:32 AM
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#6 (permalink)
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Forum Ace
Join Date: Aug 1999
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I scoured the book to see if I could find any more about Berthold. The only other thing I could find was he controlled probably the most powerful Freikorps, Eiserne Schar. It alos mentions that during the war he had one arm nearly shot off, but insisted on flying having his batman remove bone splinters do he could fly. His Schar fought in the Baltic Campaign. He had been informed about the Putsch in January, but was not kept abreast of later developments. As a reesult, he did not immediately take part.
There does not seem to be anything else.
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25 December 2001, 10:40 AM
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#7 (permalink)
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Forum Ace of Aces
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In 1999 I printed out a newspaper item (unspecified publication) cited by Hannes regarding Berthold's death. It stated that "storm troopers and militia" detained his group but implied that communists then seized the captives, who had run out of ammo. Total casualties were 19 killed and 50-ish seriously wounded including Berthold and 3 other "Baltikum troops" dead. The article concluded that after surviving the war and severe wounds he was "shot by his own compatriots."
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26 December 2001, 01:06 PM
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#8 (permalink)
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Forum Ace
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Jones says he was surrounded by a huge crowd of men, women and children and that the fire fight was the fault of one Ernst von Salomon who opened up with an mg on the crowd after Berthold had tried to negotiate with them.
Whether you article is correct and Jones incorrect, I don't know.
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30 December 2001, 01:17 PM
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#9 (permalink)
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Forum Ace of Aces
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: The American West
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Speaking of Osprey, the newest release I know of is "B-29 Hunters of the JAAF" by Koji Takaki and Henry Sakaida. An esoteric subject fershure but a fascinating treatment that's unlikely to be topped.
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30 December 2001, 11:59 PM
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#10 (permalink)
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Forum Ace of Aces
Join Date: Sep 1998
Posts: 4,093
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Barrett,
one of the German main sources about Freikorps was the book "Das Buch vom deutschen Freikorpskämpfer" published by Ernst Salomon. Maybe anybody translated this book or some reports of Freikorps-men in the book into English?
This book and others mentioned also the lynching of Berthold.
Traditional German sources for Bertholds life are Ludwig F. Gengler: "Rudolf Berthold ..." *and Thor Goote: "Kamerad Berthold - der unvergleichliche Franke" (Tatsachenroman = a novel based on facts). The most other sources use these sources and try to make Berthold into a fore-runner of the Nationalsocialist idea. I own all three mentioned books meanwhile. And ... IMHO he was really an early, possibly very idealistic kind of Nazi. He had a self-distructive kind of behaviour bordering to hysteric behaviour. As well he was ignoring the well-meaning hints of his comrades and another source commented his death in a critical way and was saying this kind of always soloing in his decisions was dooming him.
I tried repeatedly to contact the local Museum in Hamburg (the place of B.s death, Harburg, is today part of Hamburg) but did never any reply. There seems to be no public interest int he clarification of the circumstances of his death.
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