Roy Brown Believers in Action

Who started this stuff about MVR standing in his seat and turning aroung?????
It would have been impossible. He had his harness on although loose. The DrI was an extremely unstable aeroplane. It wouldn't fly straight on its own. He would have been thrown out. You ought to try and turn around to see what is behind you in a WWI aeroplane. I can't do it ! I can barely look over my shoulder. I can't see the rudder at any time. Unless I look in the mirror.
Cher'o,
Lt. Dwight Rudder, RFC

Masby, why don't you read Carisella's book before you declare yourself an expert on the autopsy and conspiracy theories. The fatal bullet entered his back and when it exited, it embedded itself in his wallet.Carisella interviewed the medical orderly who stole the bullet (and the wallet) BEFORE the autopsy, while he was preparing the body by cleaning it up and applying baking soda to the face for photographic purposes. Pictures of this are in Carisella's book. The fatal b;lullet was in the Australian's possession until 1936, when he lost it during a move. Obviously, part of the mystery was solved by this missing evidence. The Aussies stripped the tripe, including the guns (there is a photo of this in Carisella's book. He used the photo to identify the trophy hunters, and finally bought both breech blocks, which both had broken firing pins.)
Mr. Carisella spent over 40 years researching the Baron's death, in all. I suspect that somebody who spends a total of a half hour on the same project will have quite a few wrong assumptions.
And, Carisella interviewed one of the best surgeons in the US about the wound, and the reply was that death was instantaneous. If you have ever seen anyone die violently, you would have noted that their body shakes violently. This final act was witnessed by many observers on the ground as the Baron moved the stick and rudder pedals convulsively, after throwing his goggles over the side, then the tripe fell off to the left and did a soft crash into a pile of mangel beets near the Bray-Corbie road. Carisella hunted down the goggles and bought them. At his death, he had the largest collection of MVR artifacts from the death crash that ever existed. And, he was Cross and Cockade's greatest authority on MVR's death. Thus, I am not impressed by books written by Whassisname, who is a legend in his own mind.
Everyone involved on that day in 1918 are now dead, and short of an Ouija board, cannot be contacted. Read their interviews in Carisella's book. Thank the gods on Olympus that Carisella cared enough to contact them and interview them before they died. THAT is the truth, not half-baked assumptions and conspiracy theories such as are being bandied around on this forum. The official German records state MVR was killed by ground fire, and his mother was interviewed by Flying magazine before her death. She confirmed the official reports; her family had conducted its own inquiry.
Carisella obtained permission to dig lup the original gravesite, and there are pictures of this in his book. He was trying to locate the casket marker interred with the Baron. He was horrified to find that the skeleton was there except for the skull. The Mayor told him: "You dug up the remains, so they are yours." Carisella's Catholic background prevented him from photographing the remains, which he turned over to the German consulate in Paris. It is not known what they did with them. An eyewitness interviewed by Carisella said the Germans only removed the skull from the original gravesite when they re-buried him.
Read the book and learn the facts, as best they can be explained. Otherwise, stick to eyewitness accounts, official records that can be verified and not speculations.
Brown came up with so many conflicting statements over the rest of his life that no sense can be made of them. I suspect that he had some mental problems over the incident and his other wartime experiences. He was most certainly afflicted with post-traumatic stress disorder...in a time when medical science did not recognize the disorder.
Go figure. Snoopy didn't get him, Brown didn't get him...as his mother said, (This is not an exact quote; I speak no German)"No aviator could kill him. He was finally killed by ground fire."

Who said anything about the Baron "standing in his seat and turning around"? Not me. The scenario I suggested only requires that the Baron half-turn his body in his seat to check his left rear. Browns description indicates he did exactly this.

Take a bloody valium - in fact take 6 or 7 why don't you? 80% of what you posted is irrelevant or inconclusive garble. The Aussies who claimed to have found the bullet never mentioned it to anyone else at the autopsy and never produced it at any time that I'm aware of. Pretty weak. Strange that some of the Aussies claimed that Richthofen was chasing May and firing (and therefore couldn't have been hit by May), and yet "both firing pins" were broken. Which is it? The first arrivals on the scene of Richthofens crash cRe: For John L. John L pparabellum9@aol.com 980871766 0 0 You certainly don't know what you are babbling about, do you? I gave you the references and Carisella gave all of them.
You talk the talk; do you walk the walk

You certainly don't know what you are babbling about, do you? I gave you the references and Carisella gave all of them.
You talk the talk; do you walk the walk?

[Dan_San_Abbott]

John L:
It is my personal opinion that Carisella's book is absolutely a worthles piece of trash.
His claim about the goggles, hankerchief, machine gun belt, bullets and at the rest of is pure unadulterated crap. I got as as far as the skull and threw the book in the trash. I have never done that before or since. For anyone to think there is anything credible in this book will believe in the tooth fairy. Example: The MG belt is an ground MG belt, the webbing has brass tangs which would not fit through the empty belt tube used on the Fok. DR.I. This guy is no different than several who sell off phony crap. I would be careful not to give one iota of credence to this book.
Blue skies,
Dan-San Abbott

When did you first realize that you were projudiced? Saying it isn't proving it.
I spent a number of years talking with original members of Cross and Cockade on this subject, and the concwensus was that Carisella wrote the definitivwe book on the Baron's demise.
When I spoke with Carisella for extended conversations, he did not display any of the traits you credit him with.
In that Mr. Ryan is still living, you might check with him. But, then, he might not take kindly to you accusation of fraud. I sure hope you can prove what you are saying.
Would you mind showing photos of a similar belt jamming when feeding a Spandau gun? I'm sure we'd all appreciate the information. I personally have no idea where you'd find the chutes built to precise original tolerances to make this test.

What are your credentials for judging a book on WW-I aerial warfare? Maybe you should have read with an open mind, or are your opinions inscribed on tablets that Moses brought down from his encounter with a burning bush?

I don't mean to detract from this 'argument' but what may I ask is a dimple and a hanging Chad? I imagine that a dimple is a belly button, yes?

This refers to a manual voting ballot as used in Florida. A "dimple" is a dent from a stylus that does not punch out the choice because the voter did not apply enough pressure. A "hanging chad" is the portion punched out that still clings to the main ballot section by a small unperforated piece. The "chad" is the part that is to be punched out to validate the voter's choice.
Hopefully, this will soon be part of the past and all counties in Florida will adopt better methods of casting a ballot.
None of this has anything to do with anatomy.