Two on Twenty

Voss chose not to escape. The members of B flight attested to the fact he could have disengaged a number of times and escaped. After the fight most of the SE-5a that tangled with Voss on Sept.23/1917 were written off.
Are you any relation to Atkey? The reason I ask is that Atkey came relatively speaking from my own neigbourhood.

Don't really want to turn this into a voss thread, but i used to think voss could escape, till i read that there were more british watching the fight from above. I think he would have to fight his way out.

[Barrett]

The appendix in ATT shows Atkey and Anderson with 27 victories in May '18 (12 destroyed, 15 OOC). That's far more than any other Brits in a single month. Next up was Claxton in July with 18 (the appendix says 17, which was Bishop's claim that month).
Among other top Brisfit types, McKeever's best month was 8 (6 dest.) in Oct 17; Thompson had 9 (7 dest.) in May 18.
BrisFits are way cool.

[Craig]

You guys are amazing. Almost every serious scholar will allow that the British overclaimed by a factor of at least three (some say more). Yet you swallow these wild stories wothout batting an eye!

This is unavoidable: if the whole of the air service overclaimed, then so did most of its individual members.

J H C#$@#$ Craig if you can't believe the Barker last stand story or the Two VS 20, then you need your head checked for incredible BIAS.

[Craig]

Biased? Really? Who's the pot and who's the kettle? Besides, did I even mention Barker? Instead of "cursing" and calling me biased, perhaps you would do your cause a little more justice with a reasoned argument. Hmm? Give it a try? I'm game.

Ok pinned it down a little more, so you don't think the two VS twenty happened.

Why?

[Craig]

I'm not certain whether it happened or not. But I am skeptical, and here's why:

The Brits had a propensity to overestimate the damage they inflicted, i.e. overclaiming. Most serious and/or objective historians/students agree on that. With me there? So, even if they accurately estimated - in a sky swirling with airplanes - their opposition, I am doubtful that they "shot down" as many as they thought they did. As I said earlier, if the whole of the RFC overclaimed, so then did their pilots and gunners. But, if you disagree with the overclaiming premise, we have nothing to go on, and could bicker in perpetuity. Wouldn't THAT be fun!

The "TWO On Twenty" combat reports are very clear.
If colusion is suggested then the crediblity of those four men is in question, or their inability to count because of bad weather or lack of amo forced them to leave offering a fractured and disfigured report. However the report is clear:

B.F. 2B B1164; B.1253. 2/Lts. A./C. Atkey, J.E. Gurdon, C.G. Gass,A.J.H.Thorton. 6:45 p.m. 10 miles N. E. of Arras; O.P.; 15000' 4 in flames 4 crashed. "Whilst doing on O.P. in pairs, 2lt Grudon and myself dived on formation of 7 e.a. In the first dive botlhe machines shot down one e.a. in flames and on coming out or the dive, 2lt. Thornton(obs) fired at one which was on his tgail which also burst into flames. One E.A. almost collided with tail of 2nd lt. Atkey's machine and
was shot down in flames at a range of a few feet. During this fighting the ea were reinforced by two other formations which brought their numbers up to about 20. We were fighting with them for about half of an hour during which time many of them spun away possibly o.o.c. or just breaking off the engagement. Only four were actually seen to crash and are claimed by 2/Lt Atkey (2), 2/Lt. Gurdon (1), 2/Lt. Gass (1). We had then run out of amm for the back guns so broke off the fighting. As we left we counted the e.a., which did not follow us, and there were only 7 left."

So that was Dad's report at the time and I believe him. If you check today in history he encountered another large formation on 9th of May.

George Atkey

Craig, other than yourself, which serious historians/students take the positions you claim?