rené foncks double six

On two seperate occasions French pilot René Fonck downed 6 German aircraft in 1 day. Is there any other (German or alied) pilot who managed to down 6 or more aircraft in 1 day?

I think Collishaw claimed such a feat...not sure he got the credit though.

Does anyone know how well Fonck's double 6 claims stand up to german losses?

[Graeme]

Collishaw apparently received credit for all six from the RNAS but for only 1 out of control by the RFC (who said the other five were apparently out of control). The first RFC pilot to get six in a day was Capt John Trollope, closely followed by Capt Henry Woollett. I'm at work so don't have dates to hand, but both pre-date Fonck - I'll have a look later for actual dates etc. Graeme

[Craig]

Providing dates for Fonck's "double sixes" would help. I know one was in September. What day, I don't recall. When was the other, and what types of planes did he claim, where, and when?

[Graeme]

Collishaw claimed six on 6 July 1917:

11:00, Deulemont, Albatros DV, Out of Control
11:10, Menin, Albatros DV, Out of Control
11:10, Menin, Albatros DV, Out of Control
11:10, Menin, Albatros DV, Out of Control
11:10, Menin, Albatros DV, Out of Control
11:10, Menin, Albatros DV, Out of Control

Trollope claimed six on 24 March 1918:

11:00, SE Mercatel, DFW C, In Flames (shared)
11:00, E Mercatel, DFW C, Out of Control
11:05, E Mercatel, Albatros DV, Crashed
15:20, Sailly - Saillisel, Albatros C, Crashed
15:20, Sailly - Saillisel, Albatros C, Crashed
15:20, Sailly - Saillisel, Albatros C, Broke Up

Woollett claimed six on 12 April 1918:

10:30, NE La Gorgue, Two-seater, Crashed
10:30, W La Gorgue, Albatros DV, Crashed
10:40, NE La Gorgue, Albatros DV, In Flames
17:00, NE La Gorgue, Albatros DV, Broke Up
17:00, NE La Gorgue, Albatros DV, Broke Up
17:00, NE La Gorgue, Albatros DV, Crashed

Fonck's first claim for six was on 9 May 1918:

16:00, Moreuil, 2-seater, Destroyed
16:02, Moreuil, 2-seater, Destroyed
16:05, S Moreuil, 2-seater, Destroyed
18:20, Montdidier, 2-seater, Destroyed
18:55, Harlecourt - Braches, 2-seater, Destroyed
18:56, Harlecourt - Braches, 2-seater, Destroyed

His second claim for six was on 26 September 1918:

11:45, Ste Marie-a-Py, Fokker DVII, Destroyed
St Souplet, Fokker DVII, Destroyed
12:10, Perthes-les-Hurles, Halberstadt C, Destroyed
18:10, St Souplet, Fokker DVII, Destroyed
18:20, E Souain, Halberstadt C, Destroyed
E Souain, DFW C, Destroyed

Graeme

[rammjaeger]

These claims do not hamper Fonck to give partly different information in his book. In the book his victories 5 and 6 on 9th May 1918 become Fokkers (oneseaters) instead of 2 seaters and the claims number 5 and 6 on 26th September become a Fokker and an Albatros (both oneseaters) instead of Halberstadt and DFW-2 seaters in his book.He is even describing the fighting against the allegedly oneseaters. This man will be always enigmatic for me. Why did he report different types in his book? Did he not know his own victory claims and reports when he was writting the stuff? Or did he try once more to raise his successes in value? Or is there another motive or reason?

I am really interested to see what Mr Bailey and Cony are reporting here - or is the new book still unpublished?

Now that you have told fiction stories about Fonck, why don't you tell the truth about German propaganda lies all throughout the war and for many years afterward?

[Richard_Schrader]

Hannes;
I've always had a hard time believing Fonck. I think you was a bag of wind. I certainly could be wrong, he may have been erverything he said he was, but for my money I doubt it.
Richard

[rammjaeger]

"fiction stories"? The source is "Ace of the Aces", pages 97-100 and 119-122.

And yes, "Shooter", fiction stories is maybe a justified title. Start reading before complaining - and don´t miss to notice some obviously nonsense claims in the book. For example the killing of a German Ace pilot who was never existing or the claiming of the killing of another German Ace pilot who was dying in combat two days earlier. Hot stuff for guys like you.

[rammjaeger]

Richard,

the French contribution to the air war is often downplayed but I have also problems with the behaviour and claims of this man. I am seriously hoping the new book can clarify the whole thing a bit more. I am willing to correct myself concerning Fonck if a proper research shows he is not be responsible for the big mistakes in his book. (Or did the translators work so sloopy?

VBR
Hannes