Myths of our fathers...

I've been getting a chuckle out of some of the recent threads ("Happy Birthday" and "Things I never thought I knew") which concern events occuring in the American War of Independence (AWI) and the American War of 1812 (which you often need to differentiate between that and Napoleon's Russian Campaign of 1812). What amazes me is how quick people are to fall back on myth and legend when they talk about subjects outside their special interest. In this forum, as in others I frequent which specialize in those wars, many of the members rant and rave about the horror of the innacurate Hollywood portrayal of their favorite subject, fearful that the average person will believe the fiction as fact, and then state proudly that they would never do that...

Here on the Aerodrome Forum, I have been pleased to find great understanding and knowledge about an area I'm a learner in, also pleased to find that the myths of the Red Barron and the knights of the air are dutifully exposed and the (more appreciated) truth and facts take priority (generally). I have a great appreciation for this. How amusing it's been though, to hear some of you fall back to myths about the founding wars of America, about John Paul Jones and how the early wars were fought. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to criticize; I just find it fascinating.

For the information of anyone who cares, Americans did not win the AWI by fighting "indian-style", in fact, the British established an excellent corps of light infantry and modified their battalion drill to take advantage of the American terrain. In fact, Washington despaired in the beginning of ever getting his troops to be able to fight a stand-up European style battle- which he eventually did (many times!). John Paul Jones did not apparently utter "I have not yet begun to fight!" (from his own words!) and his crew was hardly the patriotic stuff of legend. In fact, most of his crew was pulled from prisons and he separated them into two factions so that one side could guard the other when changing the watch. Probably no more than 30-60 of his crew were Americans which had just been repatriated from England in a prisoner exchange. His ship was in fact fired on perhaps 3 times by a ship that was supposed to be supporting him, the Alliance. He owes his victory to his great sense of common sense, tactical opportunities, and an understanding of human nature. Oh yes, it didn't hurt that his 3 guns placed above the enemy's decks swept the Serapis' crew from their guns, and an awful good sharpshooter got onto the ends of the spars and pitched blackpowder grenades into open hatches and gun positions...

My point is to encourage you who ARE interested in this era to put the same effort into it that you do with WW1. Beware of your sources. Avoid learning history from Hollywood. Seek out first person sources. Learn who the trusted experts are. Get several points of view. Etc. If it sounds like myth, it probably is!

Very Best Regards,
Mark Daymont

In the spirit of your warning-
Would you care to name your main sources (I'm sure there are more than 1) on Jones and the Bon Homme Richard/Serapis action?

"I have not yet begun to fight" did not appear until long after the battle--about fifty years later, reported by Richard Dale, his exec.
The contemporary version, supported by Jones' own account, was in response to Pearson's question shouted from ship to ship: "Do you strike?"
Jones most likely reply was:
"I may sink, but I'm damned if I'll strike"
Less theatrical, more seamanlike--and easier to understand than the other version.
It's all explained in the Jean Boudriout book about the Bon Homme Richard.

Speaking of history, there will be a symposium in the Dayton, Ohio, area about the Wright Brothers. It will take place on September 28. I went to the website for it and it looks interesting. I urge anyone who might be interested to check it out at


http://www.libraries.wright.edu/special/symposium/

Hope you don't mind, but I wanted to get yet another website out there concerning a "local" event. Local to me, that is, but not necessarily to you all. There is a Waco fly-in held in Troy, Ohio, every August. I know that plane was developed after WWI, but it's still an impressive biplane and there are a surprising number of them still flying. I am a member of the Waco Historical Society. Check out our website at

http://wacoairmuseum.org

The fly-in is a neat event to attend. As WWI aviation enthusiasts, you would probably enjoy the sight of all those biplanes rolling out on the grass landing field.

When you put words into his mouth, you write fiction, sir.

Mark; The points you make about believing "who said what?, where, etc.", are all well known and valid by most people interested in this forum. The only thing I'll add is that when you've tracked down original sources, you still need to take them with a BIG dash of salt. The most valid accounts are usually "1st person" and therefore "personal". Too many people take an account at face value, even here.

Good point, Tony. I remember reading an article many years ago in Cross and Cockade about interviewing the WWI vets, a few of whom were still lucid and speaking in those days. One of the vets being interviewed admitted that his memory actually seemed to be improving as he got older. He was beginning even to remember things that had never happened.

When a friend and I were interviewing for Cross and Cockade (under our real names) we found that auditory delusion was quite common in older people. While most pounded away at major happenings, we found that stresing interview on the most seemingly unimportant little things that happened every day were more revealing for a flavor of the times.
Also found that talking for a while lowered the person's stress level and promoted trust. More was revealed through gossip and small talk than was ever learned from the well rehearsed
"war stories" born of a recounter's imagination. There comes a "ring of truth" when simple facts are imparted that is not present when complicated fabrications are passing one's lips.

<<Good point, Tony. I remember reading an article many years ago in Cross and Cockade about interviewing the WWI vets, a few of whom were still lucid and speaking in those days. One of the vets being interviewed admitted that his memory actually seemed to be improving as he got older. He was beginning even to remember things that had never happened.>>

"Old men forget, yet all shall be forgot, but he'll remember, with advantages, what feats he did this day."