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Old 6 February 2003, 01:09 AM   #5 (permalink)
gregoire
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Paris France
 
Books have been written on this subject (well at least chapter of books)
Vieux Charles have no particular meaning in french
Guynemer flew at least 16 different planes not all of them were called Vieux Charles
It must be nottice there was only one vieux charles at a time and only the Nieuport 10 N328 get a number "Vieux Charles III" all the othe were simply "Vieux Charles"
How did it get its name that's a mystery
there are a few theory
There was at MS a pilot called Clement Bonnard (matricule 1654) (he was not called Charles) that was flying a plane (Nieuport 18m) called the Vieux Charles (why we do not know) it is possible that Guerder was Bonnard mechanic before becoming Guynemer gunner of its first victory
Guynemer did not get its first victory flying a Vieux Charles
Guynemer may have get as its first plane in the squdron a plane called "Vieux Charles" and as its bad luck to change the name he keept it and so on his other plane
the second theory (that might be linked to the first one) is that in the same as a vieux charles plane Guynmer get a mechanic and a gunner called Charles Guerder with whom he will get his first victory
then Guynemer mentor in the squdron was Jules Vedrine whom real name was Charles he was the oldest pilot in the unit so maybe an other explanation
Then during a special mission (landing of spy behing enemy line) one of Guynemer passenger was Charles Goulard (he will get caught and shoot)
to conclude on the Vieux Charles
when Guynemer arrive at the squadron he will a Niieuport 10 nicknamed "Vieux Charles" and a mechanics (that will be a gunner) Charles Guerder.
the plane may have been nicknamed like that in reference in Verdine
Guynemer will get its first single seat victories (his second and at least few more) flying the Nieuport N320 (ther is a picture from january 16 of it with the name ) that bear the name "Vieux Charles" (the plane of Clement Bonard that will latter fly in serbia and get 4 victories) he would have keept the name for a lot of reason (he would have said to Guerder that he would keept the name because it was a lot of memories)
His first victories (the gunner name)
His first single seat victory (the plane name)
His mentor (Verdine whose real name was charles)
His first special mission passenger (Charles Goulard)
and maybe simply because he was feeling lucky with a plane nicknamed like that
it must be nottice that N320 was not the first single seat Nieuport that he flew but he get at least his 3 sfirst single seat victories (and maybe 3 more)

A last point about Nungesser and the LaVerdier well I do not know who started the legend and whoo should have baught some glass or a french dictionary but Verdier of LaVerdier is not a french word but in reality it is written Lt Verdier
Lt Louis Verdier was Nungesser best friend they were together in N65 then Verider mover to be the XO of N124 and there too Nungesser flew a lot with the N124 he was killed being the CO of spa 163 (a unit he created) the 31st august 18 after that Nungesser put it friend on his spad (he was flying a spad at this time) and swear to advenge his friend (but failed as he scored no more victory)
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