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Aircraft Topics related to WWI aircraft, aircraft engines and armament


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Old 27 January 2003, 04:21 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Some years back, I undertook a very informal study of various types for their prolonged operational service. Just from a few published sources, I came up with the Sopwith Tabloid (and its direct developments) as the design used the longest in the conflict. Sopwith Babies were still in frontline service with RNAS as late as summer 1918. Were there any other types with a longer operational service?
 
Old 27 January 2003, 10:29 AM   #2 (permalink)
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If you are considering "frontline" use:

On the German side the DFW CV served in numbers in front line service to the end.

I believe there was at least one FE2 unit flying night bombing to the end?

French probably the Spad 7. Voison 10's flew night bombing but I think the Spad 7 as a specific designation flew longer. Some earlier marks of the Voison such as the V 8 were replaced by the 10 in 1918 so certainly the Spad 7 had a longer front line career.
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Old 28 January 2003, 01:56 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Some years back, I undertook a very informal study of various types for their prolonged operational service. *Just from a few published sources, I came up with the Sopwith Tabloid (and its direct developments) as the design used the longest in the conflict. Sopwith Babies were still in frontline service with RNAS as late as summer 1918. *Were there any other types with a longer operational service?
That would need some more qualification.
Do you mena unaltered designs in frontline service?
I think the Martinsyde Elephant was in frontline service in some theater from the Fall of 1915 till the armistice. A few were used in Palestine till 1919.
The Avro 504 was in continuous service for the duration, but with some mods, and a change in roles. BUT, If you look at AIRFRAME EVOLUTION, and DESIGN LINEAGES, the DH-4 lasted a VERY LONG TIME. First evolving into the DH-9 with an engine change and redesigned crew positions, it again evolved into the DH-9A with the addition of a Liberty v-12. In about 1930, a requirement for a replacement A/C stipulated that the new machine incorporate as many components of the DH-9A as possible, the result being the Westland Wapiti, which served in the RAF and SAAF until at least 1941. While each evolutionary step resembled its predecessor, keep in mind that a Wapiti didn't have much in common with the original DH-4, exception for a tail group and wing planform that showed a family resemblnce. OUr own US built DH-4b's also lasted until about 1927-30. Bristol Scout was also a prewar design that was at least in inventory until the Armistice. IN the Dardanelles, the Scout D's were used to escort the first RNAS DH-4's to see action in that theater in 1917.
 
Old 28 January 2003, 11:54 PM   #4 (permalink)
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just to add it seems that the nieuport sesquiplane (invarious version) was still in service in november 18 (85 in front line unit) even if I doubt it was N17
the voisin got the same story from the begining to the end (but improved model)
The caudron G3 was used in large number as a trained at the end of the war
the Breguet 14 got a very long post war service (a lot of civilian use)
now I have read somewhere that the Britsol fighter had a long service post war (some served in china in the 30's) but I may be wrong
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Old 29 January 2003, 02:55 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Thanks for the input. I guess I should have added a few "qualifiers". I was thinking of 1914-18 service in the great War. Sopwith Tabloid was a pre-war design updated and in service til 1918, and in my opinion, a frontline a/c. Avroe, while also a pre-war design, did dnot remain a frontline a/c. Niether did the Bristol Scout (though maybe it should have?). Was not aware of extended use of Martinside Elefant (indeed would like to learn more about this a/c!) nor of Voisin. B.E.'s?
So maybe I should rephrase the question: Was their any pre-war design/direct development which saw more front line service in the Great War than Sopwith's developed Tabloid?
 
Old 29 January 2003, 11:54 AM   #6 (permalink)
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There is an old Profile of the Martinsyde Elephant.
According to this pub, the last combat use of them was in the Summer of 1919, against the Jungalis, by no. 63 squadron. I had thought the 504 was used as a nightfighter until the armistice. I think some Be2e's may have served in the middle east until the armistice,too. I wish there was a decent model of the Elephant. But in the last year, there has been a Scout C, Tabloid, and Schneider released, so who knows?
 
Old 30 January 2003, 02:50 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Think about the big ones!
Caproni and Ilya Murometz.
Caproni Ca.3 production started in early 1915, and in 1925 still some 38 were in production for colonial use!
Ilya hit the sky in December 1913 for the first time, and was still in use in July 1920 in Red Aviation, bombing Poles.
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Old 13 February 2003, 03:51 PM   #8 (permalink)
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The Nieuport 10 first flew in late 1914 and entered service early 1915 and was in operational use by the Russians until well after the RCW with only minor modifications.
Over half of all aircraft in the Soviet inventory after the RCW were Nieuports, and this included a significant number of Nieuport 10's. I have no information when the last of these were withdrawn from front line operational service but it was after 1922, giving well over 7 years of operational service from a single type, and a fighter at that, and examples were still serving in a number of smaller air forces until the late 1920's and early 30's though it is hard to say if combat used was intended for most of these (small airforces often don't have the luxury of having non-combat aircraft in their inventory).

The Voisin doesn't even come close and the SPAD's had an even shorter service life, and the DeHavilland/Westland connection is tenuous - there were no common major components - they started by replacing the wing, then the engine, and then finally the fuselage and the Sopwith's went through a similar development - these were not the same aircraft in anything other than general configuration.

If training use is considered to be operational then the Avro 504 wins hands down - as the last examples were only retired from RAF service after WW2 had started and while it too went through some major developments, it was still indentifiable as the same machine.

The Caproni must be the longest for operational flying (assuming shooting herders counts as operations)
 
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