The Aerodrome Home Page
Aces of WWI
Aircraft of WWI
Books and Film
The Aerodrome Forum
Sign the Guestbook
Help
Links to Other Sites
Medals and Decorations
The Aerodrome News
Search The Aerodrome
Today in History
The Aerodrome Forum

Learn how to remove ads

Go Back   The Aerodrome Forum > WWI Aviation > Aircraft


Aircraft Topics related to WWI aircraft, aircraft engines and armament


Welcome to The Aerodrome Forum, an online community where you can discuss WWI aviation with thousands of other members from around the world. To gain full access to the Forum you must register for a free account. As a registered member you will be able to:
  • Post messages and search the Forum

  • Privately communicate with other members

  • Participate in live chat sessions other members

  • View images by talented aviation artists in our Gallery

  • Buy, sell or trade items in our Classified Ads
All this and much more is available to you absolutely free when you register for an account, so sign up today! If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 25 November 2002, 11:40 AM   #1 (permalink)
GREGMC
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Since my interest in WWI aviation has re awakened I seem to remember a story of a German aviator in Africa who was a real thorn in the side of the British. My recollection is that they finally filled a balloon with explosives which brought his career to a rather abrupt end when he shot it down.

An I remembering fact or fiction? My local library doesn't seem to have as many books on WWI aviation as in my younger days.

Does anyone know the name of this pilot, his aircraft or its markings?

Thank you,

Greg
 
Old 25 November 2002, 11:45 AM   #2 (permalink)
Forum Ace
 
Cigogne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,459
 
That wasn't Africa, but rather Macedonia at Drama. The airman in question was Ltn. Rudolf Eschwege who flew there and did really well. He came to an end when the British put a balloon with the basket loaded with explosives. When he ventured to close the concussion of the blast crippled his aircraft and down he came. There are at least two photos of the crumpled wreckage of his Albatros D.III with him in the debris. Althought rumored to have flown a Halberstadt, the tailplane shape is definitely Albatros.

Cigogne
__________________
Cigogne
Cigogne is offline  
Old 25 November 2002, 11:47 AM   #3 (permalink)
Forum Ace
 
Cigogne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,459
 
... Markings? The wreckage is too bad to discern them, if any. Most aircraft flown on theatre were in factory markings. Eschwege gets special treatment in Neal O'Connor's "Aviation Awards of Imperial Germany vol. V or VI" Several nice photos of him during his service.

Cigogne
__________________
Cigogne
Cigogne is offline  
Old 26 November 2002, 08:05 AM   #4 (permalink)
GREGMC
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Cigogne,

Thank you for the information. If you would help a neophyte, how do you gather your information? Obviously one collects books, but do you use a good public source of information or perhaps the libraries of similarly interested friends?

I have read so many interesting posts on relatively obscure topics, I was just wondering.

I salute the scholars,

Greg
 
Old 5 December 2002, 12:09 PM   #5 (permalink)
ApacheBuilder
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I am not aware of any German aircraft used in Africa, but if you enjoy good historical fiction there was a book I read some years back called (if memory serves) 'he Dove of War' It chronicalled the adventures of a Taube used in Tanganyika ( I think)
There were German aircraft used in another colony, The German occupied China (colony name escapes me).
 
Old 5 December 2002, 02:35 PM   #6 (permalink)
Volker
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
*I am not aware of any German aircraft used in Africa, but if you enjoy good historical fiction there was a book I read some years back called (if memory serves) 'he Dove of War' It chronicalled the adventures of a Taube used in Tanganyika ( I think)
*There were German aircraft used in another colony, The German occupied China (colony name escapes me).

Actually, there were three German aircraft used in Africa during WW I.

These included

- A Ago Pusher in German East Africa (this actually being the sample aircraft provided by Otto for Pfalz, when they started licence manufacture of the Ago). The aircraft was brought to Africa by Bruno Buechner, who had flown it first in German South West Africa(todays Namibia), before transferring to G. East Africa (todays Tansania). Later crashed, rebuild as a seaplane (but maybe never flown as such). The engine was then used to power a railway flat car - a similar installation was used 3 years later by Fl.Abt 204 (B) in Palestine.

- a Aviatik P 14 in German South West Africa (being used for recce and bombing flights). This aircraft crashed in April 15, and it´s remains were sunk in the Lake Otjikoto when the Germans surrendered in 1915.

- A "Roland Taube" (actually also a biplane and not a Taube!) also in German SW Africa. Survived the campaign over there, was hidden when the Germans surrendered, but finally set afire in 1916.

Beside that, some German aircraft obviously flew over African soil in WW I (prime examples being the Rumpler tht photographed the pyramides at Gizeh and the Zeppelin L 59), but these did not include fighters.

Two Taubes also basically made made it to Africa, this being Jeannin Stahltauben, which arrived in Cameroon in August 1914, but it seems they were not used and maybe not even assembled over there.

The only Taube with proven use in a German colony is obviously the one flown by Guenther Plueschow in Tsingtao (which is the German colony in China mentioned by you).

Oh yes: "Dove of War" is the classical book on Tauben by De Vries.

Volker
 
Old 6 December 2002, 12:05 AM   #7 (permalink)
Fly a Sopwith Dunny...
 
Ross_Moorhouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: On a big black BMW
Posts: 3,530
 
Quote:


Actually, there were three German aircraft used in Africa during WW I.

These included

- A Ago Pusher in German East Africa (this actually being the sample aircraft provided by Otto for Pfalz, when they started licence manufacture of the Ago). The aircraft was brought to Africa by Bruno Buechner, who had flown it first in German South West Africa(todays Namibia), before transferring to G. East Africa (todays Tansania). Later crashed, rebuild as a seaplane (but maybe never flown as such). The engine was then used to power a railway flat car - a similar installation was used 3 years later by Fl.Abt 204 (B) in Palestine.


Volker
Hi Volker, Was the AGO a C II ? Do you know if there are any known photos of it in Africa ?
__________________

My Scale Model site ...

My Motorcycle Blog.

"...you can never be too dogmatic about WWI finishes." the voice of reason..

Quote:
von Richthoven: How lucky you English are to find the toilet so amusing. For us, it is a mundane and functional item. For you, the basis of an entire culture.
Ross_Moorhouse is offline  
Old 6 December 2002, 08:05 AM   #8 (permalink)
Forum Ace
 
Cigogne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,459
 
Ross, et al.

The aircraft used by Bruno Büchner in East Africa was not an AGO C.I (or C.II) type. It was an Otto Pusher. There are later photos that show the same aircraft type as an AGO pusher, but, this is a bit of a technicality. The Gustav Otto Flugmaschinenwerke of Munich was in financial trouble and went into bankruptcy in the 1913-14 timeframe. A replacement company, AGO (Ago Fluggesellschaft mbH) was reformed after the bankruptcy at Berlin-Johannisthal. I need more information about AGO, but that is basically the short outline story. The Pfalz company started building the pusher type under license to Otto in 1913 after they (Pfalz) were formed. There must have been some built after the bankruptcy when the AGO firm was established, hence some photos show the AGO pusher which was the same type of airframe. The Otto C.I was a twin-boom pusher aircraft BUT WAS NOT the AGO C.I. The concept is basically the same, but the execution was different. The only similarity to my eyes are the struts whereby the twin booms are mounted to the wing cellule. Also, there was a four-wheeled “baby carriage” type of landing gear arrangement. The later AGO C.I-II types were a more advanced design, although incorporating some of the earlier aircraft’s features. *

Gustav Otto Flugmaschinenwerke showing initial types produced:

http://204.83.160.230/archive/b/images2/Otto_werke.jpg

The Otto Pusher looks like this:

http://204.83.160.230/archive/w/images/otto_pusher.jpg

http://204.83.160.230/archive/b/images/otto.jpg

http://204.83.160.230/archive/w/images/Cou...deroyRunway.jpg

http://204.83.160.230/archive/a/images/AGO_pusher.jpg

The Otto C.I looks like this: (The type was used operationally in Bulgaria... see the booklet on the Bulgarian Airforce for some great photos!)

http://204.83.160.230/archive/images4/OTTO_Ci.jpg

The AGO C.I-II look like this:

Prototype: (note rudder shape is different than production AGO C.I type. Also, wing plan form is also different outline.)

http://204.83.160.230/archive/images4/AGO_C1.jpg

Production versions:

http://204.83.160.230/archive/images1/AGO_CI.jpg

http://204.83.160.230/archive/a/images/AGO_BENZ150.jpg

http://204.83.160.230/archive/images8/AGOc1_sanke.jpg

http://204.83.160.230/archive/w/images/AGO..._c2_crackup.jpg

http://204.83.160.230/archive/images4/AGO_C2.jpg

Naval seaplane version:

http://204.83.160.230/archive/w/images/W11...15_seaplane.jpg

I couldn't have done this without Rosebud's handy site close by to add these links. Thanks Rosebud!

Cigogne
__________________
Cigogne
Cigogne is offline  
Old 6 December 2002, 08:48 AM   #9 (permalink)
Two-seater Pilot
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 228
 
There's a photo of the Otto/Pfalz Biplane in German East Africa in the book 'Die Koniglich Bayerischen Fliegerttruppen 1912 bis 1919'/ P. Pletschacher/1992.
JohnMacG is offline  
Old 6 December 2002, 10:04 AM   #10 (permalink)
Fly a Sopwith Dunny...
 
Ross_Moorhouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: On a big black BMW
Posts: 3,530
 
Cigogne : Thank you. Now I know what aircraft Volker was talking about. Yes Rosebud is a great site.
__________________

My Scale Model site ...

My Motorcycle Blog.

"...you can never be too dogmatic about WWI finishes." the voice of reason..

Quote:
von Richthoven: How lucky you English are to find the toilet so amusing. For us, it is a mundane and functional item. For you, the basis of an entire culture.
Ross_Moorhouse is offline  
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Tags
german, fighters, africa



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rockets on German Fighters Edward Leon Hsiao Aircraft 2 10 January 2006 07:54 PM
Single Seater German Fighters That Carries Bombs Edward Leon Hsiao Aircraft 12 19 September 2005 09:35 PM
Aircraft - German East Africa alan peacock Aircraft 18 19 April 2005 12:08 PM
Exchange of Austrian/German Albatros fighters? Volker_Nemsch Aircraft 2 11 April 2003 01:55 AM
Development of German fighters Mark 1999 7 21 July 1999 01:59 AM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 01:53 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.5.1 PL1
Copyright ©1997 - 2012 The Aerodrome