Italian Flying Boat question... Macchi L.3 & M.3?

Cigogne · 25 February 2002, 05:44 AM

Alberto Casirati or any other Italian expert. Can you advise on this. I am preparing and article that was submitted for publication to OTF. In the text is mentioned the Macchi L.3 and that it was used to train US Navy pilots at Bolseno. (Bolsena?). It also shows this on the pilots certification that illustrates the article. Was the L.3 a school version of the M.3 or a totally different aircraft?

Please advise. I am working on captions and need to verify the information.

Regards,

Cigogne

Regulus · 25 February 2002, 11:57 AM

Hi Cigogne,

Maybe this helps a little.
The Macchi L3 was developped in 1916 and was a two/three seater flyingboat with two wings of unequal lenghth. In 1917 the originally indication L3 was replaced by M3 to mark the difference of concept with the original on Lohner (L) designs inspired planes of Macchi.
About 200 of these planes were constructed. In the Adriatic they were used for various tasks : bombing, reconaissance, patrols, escort. Even use as a fighter untill 1917 with the coming of the M5 oneseater ! Unbelievable !
The M3 had a Isotta-Fraschini V4B engine of 160 HP, max speed of about 145 km/hr and a range of about 450 km. Max weight was 1350 kilo's. Armement was one movable Fiat machinegun.
The type stayed in service as a trainer untill 1924. After the war a number of them were constructed for commercial purposes.

VBR from Regulus :

Regulus · 25 February 2002, 12:02 PM

Forgot the span : 15,95 meters.

VBR from Regulus

Cigogne · 26 February 2002, 08:41 AM

Regulus,

My sincere thanks for your answer. It rewarded my niggling suspicion that they were perhaps the same type. I will update my information here. On the U.S. aviator brevet shown in the article that was issued to the recipient in October 1918 it has the L.3 written in as what he was authorised to fly. So at Bolsena at least they were still referring to some of them as such.

I owe you one!

Cigogne

Regulus · 26 February 2002, 10:25 AM

Cigogne,

It seems indeed to be the case that the L3's were even in 1918 referred to as L3's. It was so that when the name was changed into M3, it did not concern a name change for the ones already build. So it is very well possible that the L3 was still mentioned in 1918.

VBR from Regulus

Cigogne · 26 February 2002, 12:04 PM

Thanks again.

leo · 28 February 2002, 01:25 AM

Weren't the Macchi flying boats direct copies of the Austrian Lohner's?

Regulus · 28 February 2002, 04:23 AM

Hi Leo,

It seems the very early models were indeed. Starting with the M3 or L3 however this was no longer the case. The M5 and M7 for example were very good flying boats that were equals of the landbased planes it had to fight concerning manoeuverability and prestations and complete Macchi designs. The M5 was good for 189 km/hour in the summer of 1917 when the first ones were delivered. The M7 was even good for 200 km. Not bad for a flyingboat of that time !

VBR from Regulus

AGO · 28 February 2002, 08:54 AM

Hi friends,
it may be interesting to note that some of the very the first seaplanes built by the A-H Navy' Arsenal were copies of the French Donnet-Levecque type A and C flying-boats (wich the KuK Marine purchased four original examples of in 1912).
The general configuration of these aircraft (pushers, hull seaplanes with pilot and observers seated side by side etc.) influenciated very deeply the trend of all following A-H seaplane designs.
The first Italian seaplanes from L1 to L3 were therefore copies of a machine wich was the evolution, albeit with much indigenous talent in it, of a French design.
But that's not still all.Infact also the FBAs wich were also employed by the Italians and the French in the Adriatic were derivative *projects of the original design of François Denhaut and as a consequence the vast majority of all the seaplanes employed in the Adriatic in WWI bore the same general configuration with consequent strong resemblance at distance.
Regards
AGO * *