Pfalz D.X

[Varese2002]

I see you are making extra hours in your libraries, and getting closer, but not close enough . To get a better look at this rarity I give a bigger version of this unique photograph. Not that you see than very much more detail, because the quality of the picture is bad, but there is no other one known till now.



I give a few hints:

- there is a Siemens-Halske Sh.III rotary of 160 hp in the front
- the machine on the photograph was authenticated by Peter M. Grosz (!)
- the unrecognisable man in the front is Gustav Bauer

Varese

[Rod_Filan]

Pfalz AIRCRAFT of World War I by Jack Herris

"The existance of the Pfalz D. IX, D. X, and D. XI is not proven. The D. IX was probably not built. The D. X was described as powered by the 160 hp Seimens-Halske Sh. III counter-rotary engine, and is probably the parasol monoplane fighter whose nose is just visable in an official film shot in 1918. Little is known of this type which did not go into production. The D. XI may have been a single bay prototype, whose twin-bay contemporary evolved into the production Pfalz D. XII, similar to the relationship of the D. Vii to the D. VII."

Question concerning Pfalz D.XII rudder Question concerning Pfalz D.XII rudder

I'll take Jack Herris' word for it and say its so. Pfalz D.X

VBR
Rod

[Breguet]

Where did you get your photo Varese?

[Varese2002]

Originally Posted by Rod_Filan

Pfalz AIRCRAFT of World War I by Jack Herris

"The existance of the Pfalz D. IX, D. X, and D. XI is not proven. The D. IX was probably not built. The D. X was described as powered by the 160 hp Seimens-Halske Sh. III counter-rotary engine, and is probably the parasol monoplane fighter whose nose is just visable in an official film shot in 1918. Little is known of this type which did not go into production. The D. XI may have been a single bay prototype, whose twin-bay contemporary evolved into the production Pfalz D. XII, similar to the relationship of the D. Vii to the D. VII."

Question concerning Pfalz D.XII rudder Question concerning Pfalz D.XII rudder

I'll take Jack Herris' word for it and say its so. Pfalz D.X

VBR
Rod

Rod has it right. A little guessing I think but this is the best what can be done with this rare machine.

This unique picture was published in the magazine Das Propellerblatt, Mitteilungsblatt der Interessengemeinschaft Luftfahrt 1900 - 1920. Number 12 (Spring 2005).

On page II/396 to II/410 there is a big article by Reinhard Kastner and Reinhard Zankl about Vizefeldwebel Gustav Bauer, Frontflieger, Fluglehrer, Erprobungsflieger.

The writer had access to the picture album of Gustav Bauer which is held by the grandson of Gustav Bauer, Fred Bruckmann in Los Angeles, USA.

On May 7th 1918 Bauer was promoted to Chief of the Flugzeugabnahme(Fluba) in Speyer (Germany) of the Pfalz Flugzeugwerke where he was responsible for testflying of new produced Pfalz machines. There are oher pictures in the article (album) of the Pfalz D.XII, D.VIII, Pfalz C.I and of course this one.

The caption of this unique picture reads in German

Nicht das beste , aber ein sehr wertvolles Bild. Es ist das einzige bekannte Foto des Pfalz Parasol-Jagdflugzeuges mit Siemens-Halske Sh.III Rotationsmotor. Vom Fachmann Peter Grosz wird die Maschine als Pfalz D.X identifiziert. Gastav Bauer (x) dürfte sie in Speyer Probe geflogen haben.

Translated

Not the best, but a priceless picture. This is the only known picture of the Pfalz Parasol fighter with Siemens-Halske Sh.III rotary engine. The expert Peter Grosz has identified this machine as the Pfalz D.X. Gustav Bauer probably testflew this machine in Speyer

It is amazing that in this late age these rarities still come to light. By the way I would be interested to see the nose of the Pfalz D.X in the official film quoted by Harris.

I find this specialist magazine (German language) very interesting, although I would not compare it regarding print quality with magazines as OTF en C&C it has sometimes very rare articles in it.

Look at their internet site:

http://www.propellerblatt.de/

Varese

Score Board at the end of Round 22 is:

5 Varese2002
4 Rbailey
2,5 Breguet
2 ercoupepilot
1,5 Rod Filan
1 Gilles
1 Cruze
1 Colin A Owers
1 bshatzer
1 Eric Goedkoop
1 JohnMacG
1 joegertler
0,5 YavorD

[Rod_Filan]

Originally Posted by Rod_Filan

"The existance of the Pfalz D. IX, D. X, and D. XI is not proven. The D. IX was probably not built. The D. X was described as powered by the 160 hp Seimens-Halske Sh. III counter-rotary engine, and is probably the parasol monoplane fighter whose nose is just visable in an official film shot in 1918. Little is known of this type which did not go into production. The D. XI may have been a single bay prototype, whose twin-bay contemporary evolved into the production Pfalz D. XII, similar to the relationship of the D. Vii to the D. VII."

I came across four letters from Max Holtzem to Peter Grosz at Ralph Cooper's website that right away narrowed it down to the D.IX or D.X http://www.earlyaviators.com/eholtzem.htm

Our monoplane is mentioned but not specifically:
No, I never saw the late Pfalz Parasol nor do I have a picture of it. I would like to have one if you have it [...]

The existence of the D.XI is confirmed:
[...] your last letter of Jan. 13th, with the picture of the Pfalz experimental D.D. of 1916. And don't let us call it any longer D-IV! I had never heard called it that and remember the Pfalz D-III was not yet existing when I flew this X-D.D. in the summer of 1916. [...]
D XI was prototype DD, 2 struter 160 HP Mercedes.
D XI went into production with BMW
DXV lower wing below fuselage,BMW, No production only 2 ships were made. One given to Udet, I was there in Speyer a few days after the armistice, on my way to Munich with my Fok.D-VIII, and not going to Strasburg to hand it over to the Allies. That very Pfalz D-XV (Udet's Pfalz) I flew in Argentina doing stunt exhibition. [...]

Dan-San, in the D.XII rudder thread, suspects the D.X was a single-bay biplane and when refering to the D.IIIa in Jack Herris' book says:
There were two experimental versions that led to the production Pfalz D.XII. I suspect the single bay prototype was the Pfalz D.X and the two bay was the Pfalz D.XI. Jack Herris has made an incorrect identification of the photograph. [...]

The above statements would lead me to believe the D.IX was indeed built and was the elusive parasol - at the same time putting a shadow of doubt on the accuracy of Jack Herris..

"Vom Fachmann Peter Grosz wird die Maschine als Pfalz D.X identifiziert."
I'm happy to earn a point but I'm also interested how Peter came to this conclusion.
Pull another rabbit out of your hat Varese and show me the Pfalz D.IX ! heh heh

VBR
Rod

[Varese2002]

Rod.

I will look into it further. Very interesting these elusive Pfalz machines. Have you seen or available

The D. X was described as powered by the 160 hp Seimens-Halske Sh. III counter-rotary engine, and is probably the parasol monoplane fighter whose nose is just visable in an official film shot in 1918.

the official film of 1918? I might be able to make a still picture of the type to compare it in detail.

Varese

[Craig]

Wonderful! Thank you so mush for posting this - I have always wanted to see an image of ther Pfalz parasol.

Now, if someone comes up with one of the experimental Pfalz D.IIIa with the Benz V-8, I'll just have to pass out from delerious joy!

[EricGoedkoop]

Started this new thread by Varese's request.

[Varese2002]

I will inquire by the writers of the article in Propellerblatt if they have evidence in writing of Peter M. Grosz to identify the parasol Pfalz as a D.X.

Tomorrow I will try elaborate on the different opinions of the D.IX, D.X and D.XI.

Varese

[Varese2002]

Today I have send a mail to Reinhard Zankl - one of the editors of the German specialist WW1 magazine Propellerblatt - to enquire about the identification of the Pfalz parasol fighter in a unique picture published in this magazine.

If possible I also wanted to know what reasoning / data Peter M. Grosz had to identify the machine as a Pfalz D.X.

To recapitulate, the stakes are on for this machine.

Dan San Abbott http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/sh...7&postcount=10

There were two experimental versions that led to the production Pfalz D.XII. I suspect the single bay prototype was the Pfalz D.X and the two bay was the Pfalz D.XI. Jack Herris has made an incorrect identification of the photograph.
The fuselage of the single and two bay prototypes is hardly a Pfalz D.IIIa, first of all it does not have an integral built fin.
The ear radiators would not have been accepted on the production machine. Idflieg has forbidden there use on front aircraft. I suspect the Pfalz engineers were trying to resolve the nose radiator problem and used the ear radiator and interim radiator. The new wings were too thin for a wing mounted air foil radiator.
The front half of the fuselage appears to be the same construction as the Pfalz D.IIIa and aft of the firewall former a new design of the Pfalz D.XII.
The thin wings of the single bay prototype were inadquately supported, which most likely led to the acceptance of the two bay configuration that became the Pfalz D.XII.

Careful reading gives there is no proof but an hypothesis about the D.X and D.XI as precursors of the D.XII.

Max Holtzem Who was the testpilot for Pfalz. http://www.earlyaviators.com/eholtze5.htm In correspondence with Peter M. Grosz, januari 22nd 1964

D XI was prototype DD, 2 strutter 160 HP Mercedes.
D XI went into production with BMW

http://www.earlyaviators.com/eholtze7.htm

No, I never saw the late Pfalz Parasol nor do I have a picture of it.

Summarizing, we do not have very hard evidence of the machines.

The D.XI seems reasonably clear given the sttement by Max Holtzem that it was a two bay double-decker (DD). The prototype for the D.XII.

The late parasol fighter was strangely not seen by Holtzhem, who was the testpilot of the Pfalz factory . It was seen by Gustav Bauer, who was chief of the Flugzeugbauabnahme (Fluba) at Pfalz Flugzeugwerke in Speyer, actually he is photographed before the machine.

No evidence at he moment is available why Peter M. Grosz identified the parasol Pfalz as a D.X.

So we havelittle on these mystery planes ...

D.X no evidence
D.XI