Breguet's Crash File Challenge #287

[YavorD]

Another crash site, on behalf of AROTH.
Good hunting!
Yavor

The scoreboard.

34.3 FOKKERJ Feuchtwanger
27.0 Froggy
26.3 Rbailey
19.60 Breguet
17.15 YavorD
12.3 Flamingo
09.75 Aquilius
08.3 Varese2002
08.0 ONEALM
07.6 Rod_Filan
07.9 Gregvan
06.2 Richard B
06.15 AROTH
05.75 Ross
05.7 Jeroplan
05.5 Expositor
05.5 Gilles
05.0 Dan_San
05.0 Kilian
04.0 Edmond
04.0 Eric
04.0 Laserlloyd
03.5 sergio_vitalio
03.3 PaulForster
03.2 Colin A Owers
03.2 Crankcase
03.0 Crimso
03.0 Patrick
02.7 Tbstreet
02.0 Cruze
02.0 Rickenbaron
01.8 gregorydquist
01.8 Tom L
01.5 Nieuport 14
01.25 Ransom E. Olds
01.0 '14-'18aviationcollector
01.0 Ampovandak
01.0 Berman
01.0 brisfitworks
01.0 Cliff
01.0 Pvernon
01.0 rammjaeger
01.0 RONNY BAR
01.0 Troy Raines
00.5 Miroslav Pokorny
00.1 SCMc

Breguet's Crash Files

Rules:
1) All aircraft are of the 14-18 period (ie either designed or left the ground during this period).
2) All "ACES" with a score of 5.0 or higher must obey the 3.0 hour handicap. All others with a score of ZERO to 4.99 may start immediately, if not sooner!
3) And whom ever wins this challenge will have to provide a new one! If this can not be done for any reason, please PM Breguet and he will take over as host!
4) The final arbitrator of all things to do with the "rules" is Breguet.
5) ALL VIOLATORS WILL BE DEALT WITH SEVERELY!

[Jeroplan]

Could it be another Russian Morane Saulnier Type G?

[Froggy]

Bonsoir

May be a Ponnier Trainer D III ?

Bruno

[YavorD]

It is braced monoplane tractor but nothing else fits the Morane-Saulnier type G.
Not a Ponnier either.
Regards,
Yavor

[Froggy]

2nd Guess a Nieuport 6M (with a front skid)which were used by russian aviation as trainer
the rudder of the photo fit with a Nieuport 6 M

Bruno

[AROTH]

This is gonna be a tough one.......

Doesn't look like a 6M due to the straight parallel wings and (similar looking tailplane) as the 6M has tapered wings and a rounded tailplane which is mounted on the top longerons. Also, the landing gear config is different.

But, I still am looking...been thru my French, Italian and Russian books with no matches yet......

I still have more resources to check.....

[YavorD]

AROTH is right, such a combination of undercarriage, tail surfaces and wing shape is distinctive. No such Nieuport flew, as much as I know (and I studied Nieuport monoplanes quite thoroughly early this year).
Regards,
Yavor

[Froggy]

Bonjour Yavor

May be my source is wrong(French aircraft of ww1) but it is said that "Nieuport 4/6 m was used by operational units from 1912 thtough 1915, and served as trainer from 1915 to 1925-Nesterov was flying one of these aircraft when he became the first pilot to perform a loop they were also built at the Schchetinin and Dux plants-"

here is a line up of Nieuport 6M in IRAS service


I search in another direction

Cordialement
Bruno

[YavorD]

Hi Bruno,

Nieuport IV (Gnome 70) was very important first line (reconnaissance) aeroplane in Imperial Russian Air Service up to the summer of 1915, about half the aeroplanes available in August 1914. The aeroplane was produced by several Russian factories, including Dux. Nieuport II and III were used in the same time as trainers. Russian sources never mentioned Nieuport VI being used.
Your quote is correct concerning the big picture, although early Nieuport section within Davilla and Soltan book is not very precise.
It is not a Nieuport anyway.

• One can see undercarriage strut - an attachment point somewhere close to the wing leading edge.
• Nieuport "trade mark" wing warping control rod is not present too.
• Wing chord looks to be constant, not decreasing towards the wing tip.
• Rudder is not comma-shaped.
• Tail-skid is different.
• ...

Regards,
Yavor

[YavorD]

P.S. I should admit, the picture in question was miscaptioned as Nieuport at least once …