Aircraft id/year help

jc · 24 September 2008, 03:52 AM

Needing help with this picture: aircraft, year. It reads CLEVELAND something? on the back. Thanks, Jc

matte_kudasai · 24 September 2008, 04:27 AM

Sikorsky S-38 of 1928 year.

jc · 24 September 2008, 04:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by matte_kudasai

Sikorsky S-38 of 1928 year.

Thanks Matt! This will help us try to figure out the boy in the picture & where they were at.

Jim · 24 September 2008, 07:42 AM

I can not increase the size of the photo to see what markings it may have. The Sikorsky S-38 was the main aircraft Pan Am used when they started up. They used it on their first routes around the Caribbean and down into Central and South America where they were in service for many years afterwards, even after the larger 4 engined S-40s and S-42s were developed and brought into Pan Am's rapidly growing fleet of the 1930s.

The main U.S. base of operations was on Dinner Key in Biscayne Bay, and their original building is now City Hall for Miami.

Some S-38s were bought and used by wealthy individuals at private 'air yachts', a couple were bought by the military, but most were used by Pan Am.

jc · 24 September 2008, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim

I can not increase the size of the photo to see what markings it may have. The Sikorsky S-38 was the main aircraft Pan Am used when they started up. They used it on their first routes around the Caribbean and down into Central and South America where they were in service for many years afterwards, even after the larger 4 engined S-40s and S-42s were developed and brought into Pan Am's rapidly growing fleet of the 1930s.

The main U.S. base of operations was on Dinner Key in Biscayne Bay, and their original building is now City Hall for Miami.

Some S-38s were bought and used by wealthy individuals at private 'air yachts', a couple were bought by the military, but most were used by Pan Am.

Thats what I found after Matt gave me the name, looks like this one could be one of 101? I didn't want to make photo to large. Send me your email & I get you a copy. The pic. is very low quality! I do see CLEVELAND & about 4 other letters maybe (news)? Thanks!

Jim · 24 September 2008, 09:54 AM

Some S-38s were also used by other airlines and contractors on the U.S. mail routes of that era when there were lakes or rivers with a couple thousand feet or so of unobstructed and relatively calm water on which a flying boat could be landed thus avoiding the cost of building an airport or making it more convenient to a central down-town area where an airport could not be built and where mail could be speeded along. Some other S-38s were used by Inter-Island Airways in the early days of that airline that flew people locally between the Hawiian Islands.

I will send you my email so you can forward the photo.

Jim · 24 September 2008, 10:03 AM

By the way, Igor Sikorsky is the guy who designed these. He was the same guy who had designed the famous Ilya Muromets giant (98 foot wingspan) bombers during WW I for the Russian government. He emigrated to the U.S. after the war and after a while started his own aircraft company in Connecticut. The S-38 is an example of one of his designs that they made that led to the wild success of Pan Am and the their large flying boats of the 1930s. He is also the guy who is generally credited with inventing the modern helicopter.

jc · 24 September 2008, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim

I can not increase the size of the photo to see what markings it may have. The Sikorsky S-38 was the main aircraft Pan Am used when they started up. They used it on their first routes around the Caribbean and down into Central and South America where they were in service for many years afterwards, even after the larger 4 engined S-40s and S-42s were developed and brought into Pan Am's rapidly growing fleet of the 1930s.

The main U.S. base of operations was on Dinner Key in Biscayne Bay, and their original building is now City Hall for Miami.

Some S-38s were bought and used by wealthy individuals at private 'air yachts', a couple were bought by the military, but most were used by Pan Am.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim

By the way, Igor Sikorsky is the guy who designed these. He was the same guy who had designed the famous Ilya Muromets giant (98 foot wingspan) bombers during WW I for the Russian government. He emigrated to the U.S. after the war and after a while started his own aircraft company in Connecticut. The S-38 is an example of one of his designs that they made that led to the wild success of Pan Am and the their large flying boats of the 1930s. He is also the guy who is generally credited with inventing the modern helicopter.

I thought this guy was very intresting & smart as I was reading his bio. When I seen the word "helicopter" it broght back to mind of a dear friend of

Weir Cooks. Cook taught this man how to fly, then he went on later to become one of the best test pilots for the US.

Jim · 24 September 2008, 01:38 PM

Thanks for sending the photo. I looked really hard at it and as you say it is not high definition. I can barely make out what looks to be the word 'CLEVELAND' on one of the tail booms. That is the area where owners typically put either their airline names or the name of the aircraft or where the military put their identifying markings.

I am not aware of an airline called Cleveland Airways or such so I am not much help on that. I can say that it is not a Pan Am owned S-38 as they also painted their winged globe emblem on the nose. Also, it is not a military owned one either as the livery is not military.

The earliest this photo could be is 1928 since that is when S-38s were first made, but it could also be anytime after that through the 1930s or even in the 1940s as they were operated for a long time.

If this one is somehow related to someone operating it around Cleveland or that region it would make sense given the city is on the lake and S-38s were operated in that area to take passengers and mail around to other cities on the Great Lakes in both the U.S. and Canada. Naming such an aircraft the Cleveland would make sense, but that is just a wild guess.

Sorry I can't nail it down any further. Maybe someone else here might know about this particular S-38.

jc · 24 September 2008, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim

Thanks for sending the photo. I looked really hard at it and as you say it is not high definition. I can barely make out what looks to be the word 'CLEVELAND' on on of the tail booms. That is the area where owners typically put either their airline names or the name of the aircraft or where the military put their identifying markings.

I am not aware of an airline called Cleveland Airways or such so I am not much help on that. I can say that it is not a Pan Am owned S-38 as they also painted their winged globe emblem on the nose. Also, it is not a military owned one either as the livery is not military.

The earliest this photo could be is 1928 since that is when S-38s were first made, but it could also be anytime after that through the 1930s or even in the 1940s as they were operated for a long time.

If this one is somehow related to someone operating it around Cleveland or that region it would make sense given the city is on the lake and S-38s were operated in that area to take passengers and mail around to other cities on the Great Lakes in both the U.S. and Canada. Naming such an aircraft the Cleveland would make sense, but that is just a wild guess.

Sorry I can't nail it down any further. Maybe someone else here might know about this particular S-38.

Thanks, If I can figure out who the boy is I can get an age/year. Maybe it is being shown like at a race or it is just at a hanger. At least I have a name so I can keep an eye out for it maybe in a letter.