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Old 7 March 2010, 07:15 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Breguet's aircraft ID challenge #712

Bonsoir à tous .

An easy one :

I browsed twice the previous challenges ,and used the "search " fonction :
Amazingly ,it seems to have never been offered here.

Good luck

Richard






Previous Aeroplanes 1914 - 1918* -* Breguet's Aircraft Challenge* --

Rules

The thread title must be "Bréguet's aircraft ID challenge #......"
The score board, link and rules must be copied to the beginning of each thread, so that we know where we are. The score board and the correct answer to the challenge must also be placed at end of each thread.
The completed aircraft must have been either; designed, built or have left the ground during the '14-'18 period and be identifiable by the poster.
The photo must show the whole aircraft - from whatever angle, or at least 2 views of a 3 view drawing (photo by preference).
Challenges which depict a machine already earlier presented are disqualified (always check the list at Aeroplanes 1914 - 1918* -* Breguet's Aircraft Challenge* -- when in doubt !).
If there is any doubt as to the eligibility of an aircraft for the challenge details should be PM'd to Breguet BEFORE the aircraft is submitted.
Once someone has got 5 correct answers under their belt they become an ACE. Once they become an ACE they must wait 12hrs after the posting of the new challenge before they can post an answer.
To be eligible for correct ID an answer must include at least one characteristic of the aircraft that helped in its identification.
The first person to ID the challenge correctly gets to post the next challenge. If this can not be done for any reason Breguet himself will post the next challenge.
If an ace gives the correct answer too early, the challenge is over, he gets no point but has to post the next one. In lieu of the fact that the "novices" have in effect been "cheated" of their "exclusive" time that next post should be a relatively easy one. Anyone repeating the correct answer at the right time gets neither a point nor the right to post the next challenge.
The final arbiter in relation to questions about the rules will be Breguet.


The score at the end of Challenge # 711 – Lloyd C.I

128.90 Varese2002 ¤¤
93.00 Dave_Kent ¤
81.20 Rbailey ¤
33.30 Cruze ¤
29.70 richard B ¤
24.70 Aquilius
21.20 YavorD
20.80 Lodzermensch
20.35 Froggy
15.90 Flamingo
13.80 Rod Filan
10.45 GregE
09.50 matte_kudasai
09.00 Breguet
08.70 Dan-San
08.40 JohnMacG
07.70 EdStevens
07.60 trp81
07.30 Patrick
07.10 Colin A. Owers
06.70 Ampovandak
06.70 Berman
06.10 joegertler
06.00 Eric Goedkoop
05.90 Doc
05.70 AROTH
05.70 FOKKERJ Feuchtwanger
05.60 ercoupepilot
05.30 Crimso
05.30 Der Grüne Flieger
05.20 Maze
05.20 Gilles
05.10 bshatzer
05.00 Tom L..........................have to wait 12 hours

04.70 dpolglaze........................ may start immediately
04.40 Ross Moorhouse
04.30 edmondthieffry
04.20 Rufe
04.00 greenknight
04.00 sobrien
03.90 Brad
03.00 SCMc
02.50 Gregoire
02.50 Rexee
02.10 Crankcase
02.00 austin08
02.00 Rickenbaron
01.70 Kilian
01.60 airplane176
01.60 sergio_vitalio
01.50 Albatros_Ace
01.30 Cigogne
01.30 ckingh5
01.25 Ermeio Congratulations
01.20 Ransom E. Olds
01.00 Catfish
01.00 Cliff
01.00 cubsfan4life
01.00 gregorydquist
01.00 Luf-Rick
01.00 Mike Westorp
01.00 paolomiana
01.00 Peter Zambori
01.00 rammjaeger
01.00 SL DIII
01.00 Tripehound
00.90 Stig Jarlevik
00.80 Machinbird
00.80 Mad Mac
00.80 tbstreet
00.80 toxisch
00.60 Sreiko
00.50 ’14-‘18aviationcollector
00.50 Martin Irvine
00.40 Vilkata
00.30 albapfalzd30
00.30 Miroslav Pokorny
00.30 Nieuport14
00.20 Paul_J._Fisher
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Old 7 March 2010, 08:14 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Hello Richard B,

I believe this is the rare "Square Nosed Fokkker"!

HAPPY HUNTING, FOKKERJ
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Old 7 March 2010, 08:28 AM   #3 (permalink)
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"Once someone has got 5 correct answers under their belt they become an ACE. Once they become an ACE they must wait 12hrs after the posting of the new challenge before they can post an answer."

05.70 FOKKERJ Feuchtwanger

FokkerJ ,you are an ACE :you are NOT allowed to answer until 12 hrs waiting .
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Old 7 March 2010, 10:40 AM   #4 (permalink)
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No problem Richard.... When nobody is looking, you could deduct 1.0 from my score,
then once again I could prove that I know how to "Make An ACE Out of Myself"!

Cheers, FOKKERJ
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Old 7 March 2010, 05:30 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Did that squat, little, fat thing actually get off the ground?
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Old 7 March 2010, 09:53 PM   #6 (permalink)
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This is the A.E.G. Eule (Owl) designed by Ing. Wagner. On the picture is the first example which was powered by a Gnôme rotary. The machine took fire when repairs were done on the oil tank, which wrecked the machine completely before finishing the trial flights.

Identification is easy for this stubby looking monoplane with a Gnôme tractor and its special form of wing. Very advanced for the time.

There was a second example with a different engine (4-cylinder in-line engine), which when tests were halted was preserved within A.E.G. in Henningsdorf as a special memento.

Eventually the machine came in the possession of the Deutsche Luftfahrt Sammlung in Berlin in the 1930's. The machine was during the WW2 transported into Poland to safeguard it for allied bombing. The machine still survives in the Cracow museum lacking engine, propeller, wheels, wings and rudder. The remains look somewhat 'traurig'. The machine will remain in Cracow but will not be restored. It is not on public view in the Cracow museum, although some pictures can be seen on the internet.

Source: Hundertmark, Michael and Holger Steinle. Phoenix aus der Asche. Die Deutsche Luftfahrt Sammlung Berlin

I have seen that Lange (1986) has as so often a somewhat different story, but I prefer the work of Hundertmark.

Cheers

Kees
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Last edited by Varese2002; 7 March 2010 at 10:01 PM. Reason: Identification added
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Old 7 March 2010, 11:28 PM   #7 (permalink)
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CONGRATULATION ,Kees ,it's the A.E.G Eule ,designed by Ing. Wagner.

In P.W. Cohausz 's book - Deutsche Flugzeuge bis 1945 -we can read the same story ,so I have nothing more to tell about it. (Designation is A.E.G. E2 "Eule" ,but I doubt E 2 being official ...)

In Propeller Blatt Nr 13 (2005) it is said to have begun its trials during the spring 1915.
A first AEG ED was built in 1912/13 ,a pic of it is in the P.B Nr 13 ,but crashed ... Seems to be a Taube ...

Here a picture of a model of the Eule shown at the Technische Museum Berlin

[URL=http://img697.imageshack.us/i/rtsela.jpg/][/URL

The score at the end of Challenge # 712 – A.E.G. Eule ,second AEG monoplane ,1914/15

129.90 Varese2002 ¤¤
93.00 Dave_Kent ¤
81.20 Rbailey ¤
33.30 Cruze ¤
29.70 richard B ¤
24.70 Aquilius
21.20 YavorD
20.80 Lodzermensch
20.35 Froggy
15.90 Flamingo
13.80 Rod Filan
10.45 GregE
09.50 matte_kudasai
09.00 Breguet
08.70 Dan-San
08.40 JohnMacG
07.70 EdStevens
07.60 trp81
07.30 Patrick
07.10 Colin A. Owers
06.70 Ampovandak
06.70 Berman
06.10 joegertler
06.00 Eric Goedkoop
05.90 Doc
05.70 AROTH
05.70 FOKKERJ Feuchtwanger
05.60 ercoupepilot
05.30 Crimso
05.30 Der Grüne Flieger
05.20 Maze
05.20 Gilles
05.10 bshatzer
05.00 Tom L..........................have to wait 12 hours

04.70 dpolglaze........................ may start immediately
04.40 Ross Moorhouse
04.30 edmondthieffry
04.20 Rufe
04.00 greenknight
04.00 sobrien
03.90 Brad
03.00 SCMc
02.50 Gregoire
02.50 Rexee
02.10 Crankcase
02.00 austin08
02.00 Rickenbaron
01.70 Kilian
01.60 airplane176
01.60 sergio_vitalio
01.50 Albatros_Ace
01.30 Cigogne
01.30 ckingh5
01.25 Ermeio Congratulations
01.20 Ransom E. Olds
01.00 Catfish
01.00 Cliff
01.00 cubsfan4life
01.00 gregorydquist
01.00 Luf-Rick
01.00 Mike Westorp
01.00 paolomiana
01.00 Peter Zambori
01.00 rammjaeger
01.00 SL DIII
01.00 Tripehound
00.90 Stig Jarlevik
00.80 Machinbird
00.80 Mad Mac
00.80 tbstreet
00.80 toxisch
00.60 Sreiko
00.50 ’14-‘18aviationcollector
00.50 Martin Irvine
00.40 Vilkata
00.30 albapfalzd30
00.30 Miroslav Pokorny
00.30 Nieuport14
00.20 Paul_J._Fisher

Last edited by richard B; 7 March 2010 at 11:41 PM.
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Old 8 March 2010, 11:38 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Here is a
new photo of this owl:
Photos: AEG Wagner Eule Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net
any 3-view of the aircraft?
ermeio
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Old 8 March 2010, 12:04 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ermeio View Post
Here is a
new photo of this owl:
Photos: AEG Wagner Eule Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net
any 3-view of the aircraft?
ermeio
This is the second example, now in the sheds of the Cracow Museum (Poland). As you can see it is heavily damaged and vital elements are missing. The second example had a 4-cylinder inline engine (no rotary engine here).

Peter M. Grosz had an article about this machine in the US magazine WW1 Aero with more pictures and info.

Cheers

Kees
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Old 3 April 2010, 11:13 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Varese2002 View Post
This is the A.E.G. Eule (Owl) designed by Ing. Wagner. On the picture is the first example which was powered by a Gnôme rotary. The machine took fire when repairs were done on the oil tank, which wrecked the machine completely before finishing the trial flights.
Reading a history of A.E.G. I read about that specific incident, which was even worse than I had thought.
Im Frühjahr 1915 hatten bereits die ersten Rollversuche stattgefunden. Durch unvorsichtiges hantieren bei einer Tankreparatur fing die Maschine Feuer, das schnell auf fünf danebenstehende Flugzeuge übergriff, scließlich die ganze Halle erfasste und alles vernichtete.
Translated ....
In spring 1915 initial taxiing tests were already finished. Because of careless repair of a petrol tank the machine caught fire, which quickly spreaded to five aeroplanes which were standing nearby. In the end the whole hall caught fire and was totally destroyed.
The repair of the petrol tank was probably careless, but general safety was not much cared for also, because one fire could destroy the whole hangar, inclusive of five aeroplanes

Cheers

Kees
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