Q? re. fuselage stripes on Barker's B6313

tbell · 21 July 2009, 08:18 AM

Looking at Barker's Snipe in the Canadian War Museum in Ottawa, it's evident that the fuselage stripes were white over PC10, i.e. there was no black.

My question is, would his Camel have been painted the same way, or is there some compelling evidence that the stripes were white and black?

Cheers,
Tony Bell

Kirk R. Lowry · 21 July 2009, 10:08 AM

Bonjour Tony!

There has long been conjecture about the markings applied to good ole' B6313.

When

William Barker took command of 139 Squadron the Bristol F.2bs which equipped the unit had a marking of white stripes 'round the rear fuselage, apparently two to begin with and latter more.

Les Rogers, in

British Aviation Squadron Markings of World War I, notes that "in some cases a black band was inside the two white bands", so, it is thought that two colour combinations were used. As for B6313, when flown by Barker with the unit, photographic evidence and logic would lead one to conclude that when four white stripes were applied the three stripes within were black as that is the appearance and some believe that other portions of the aircraft were painted black as well. When B6313 was adorned with seven stripes the evidence is not conclusive as the shade within the stripes does not appear different from that on the fuselage outside the stripes and some of the black, if that was what had been applied, has been removed.

So, it may have been, that one version was stripes white and black and one version was stripes white and PC10.

What do you think Tony?

Kirk

tbell · 21 July 2009, 10:26 AM

Thanks, Kirk.

Sounds like either way could be accurate, then. When I get home after work I'll have to take a closer look at my references to see if it points one way or another. Unfortunately the only picture I have is a postage stamp sized one in the Osprey Camel Aces book.

BTW, are you any relation to Ron Lowry? I knew him quite well via the Toronto modelling crowd...

Cheers,
Tony

Kirk R. Lowry · 21 July 2009, 09:00 PM

Yes, Tony, Ron was my father!

I could send some other images of B6313 along if you like ...

Have you seen the latest issue of Over the Front? The last painting completed by my father, of 'Wop' May flying with

Manfred von Richthofen behind, is on the back cover. It looks excellent!

Salut!
Kirk

Graham Hunter · 22 July 2009, 07:33 AM

Here are two photos of B6313 with 4 and 7 white stripes. Notice the variance in the width of stripes on the latter. I would say that the 4 stripe
B6313 is definately white and black. Not os sure about the added stripes.

You have to take into account that B6313 was reskinned several times during its service.

BarkerB6313-139c.jpg

BarkerB6313-139e.jpg

Graham Hunter · 22 July 2009, 07:36 AM

Also regarding Barker's Snipe, this was a temporary posting and there would not have been time to paint the white-black-white stripes.

tbell · 22 July 2009, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirk R. Lowry

Yes, Tony, Ron was my father!

I could send some other images of B6313 along if you like ...

Have you seen the latest issue of Over the Front? The last painting completed by my father, of 'Wop' May flying with

Manfred von Richthofen behind, is on the back cover. It looks excellent!

Salut!
Kirk

I'm not surprised that Ron was your dad! The chances of there being another, unrelated Lowry with an interest in WWI aviation in the Toronto area was just too slim! As I'm sure you're aware, your dad was warmly regarded in the modelling community. He is greatly missed and still comes up frequently in conversation.

I haven't seen the "Over the Front" issue, but I'll have to keep my eye out for it next time I'm at Aviation World. I'd also appreciate any pics of B6313 that you might have.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graham Hunter

Here are two photos of B6313 with 4 and 7 white stripes. Notice the variance in the width of stripes on the latter. I would say that the 4 stripe
B6313 is definately white and black. Not os sure about the added stripes.

You have to take into account that B6313 was reskinned several times during its service.

That's just what I needed Graham, thanks! Even though the later picture is quite a bit more contrasty, it looks to me as though the stripes are indeed black.

I'm currently building the 1/48 Eduard kit in Barker's earlier No. 28 Sqn markings, but plan to do the same kit up in No. 139 Sqn livery some time in the future.

Thanks again guys!

Kirk R. Lowry · 26 July 2009, 09:46 AM

Tony, as is well known, different photographs leave different impressions ... have a look at this image of B6313 -

William Barker runs the engine of Sopwith Camel B6313 behind chocks.

I would suggest you seek out a copy of Sopwith Camel -King of Combat by Chaz Bowyer which reproduces several photographs of B6313 and can be found in two, somewhat, different editions either of which would be of great help with the projects.

Salut!
Kirk

Graham Hunter · 31 July 2009, 07:29 AM

Tony,

Regarding the Snipe, does the PC10 fabric appear to be original?

tbell · 31 July 2009, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graham Hunter

Tony,

Regarding the Snipe, does the PC10 fabric appear to be original?

I'm pretty certain it is original. It certainly doesn't look like it's ever been restored.

The plaque next to the exhibit reads, "This is the fuselage of Barker's Sopwith Snipe. He flew it during his Victoria Cross-winning action on 27 October 1918. Barker crashed after the battle, but the plane was recovered and designated an official War Trophy."

I have a bunch more shots of it that were posted on the World War I Modeling Page. I also have the full resolution files stored locally.

Cheers,
Tony