Early Nieuports interplane struts tape bindings colour

Greybeard · 2 January 2010, 03:33 AM

According to Rick Kent, Nieuports 16 belonging to 11th Squadron, RFC, did have their tape bindings of interplane struts coloured dull red.

I wonder if all early Nieuport sesquiplanes, included types X, XI and XII, did have same feature.

GB

Dan_San_Abbott · 3 January 2010, 03:09 PM

Hi Greybeard:
What is Rick Kent's data source of the deep red color on the strut bindings? All the data I have, the binding are natural linen color with a varnish finish. No red.
Happy New Year Greybreard,
Dan-San

Greybeard · 4 January 2010, 04:16 AM

Hi Dan and Happy New Year to you too.

Don't know about Rick Kent's sources: I just read following article:

Camouflage & Markings - French Fighters in British Service During WW1

Being an IPMS member I thought him reliable. If you see at Nie 11 & 16 profiles you'll see red stripes; also, text about Nie. 16 reads:<<The interplane struts are varnished natural wood with dull red tape bindings.>>

Greetings
GB

Greybeard · 5 January 2010, 03:51 AM

Dan-San,

do you think I deserve an answer or my reply is so despicable to be not worth of it?

GB

SCMc · 5 January 2010, 08:26 AM

Hi GB,

Rick Kent's profiles offer an interesting possiblity that the reinforcing bands could have been treated differently, but to get people interested, there needs to be stronger evidence than a couple of profiles. Perhaps someone here knows of Nieuport photos with darker bands on the struts, or some other evidence. Perhaps someone knows Rick Kent, and can find his source. Either way it may take time for the person (if they exist) to find this thread and respond.

Dan-San was kind enough to respond to the best of his knowledge. Please respect that.

Steve

flypaper · 5 January 2010, 10:00 AM

looking through "French Aircraft of the First World War" almost all the Nieuport Aircraft seemed to have "light" wrappings against the wood of the strut, but for one! A picture on page 365, a famous photo of French ace de Turenne standing in the cockpit of his Nieuport. The tapes are darker than the wood of the Struts. In this photo the sky blue of de Turenne's a/c appears as a very light gray, and the red appears as black, and the tapes fall in a shade between the two. The artwork for this a/c in the color section shows the tapes as white, but my feeling is the artist used what he thought he knew about Nieports to do the color work. What color were de Turenne's tapes I wouldn't hazard a guess....but neither would I say that all Nieuport tapes are white.

Not much help, but still opens up the possablities...

Flypaper

Dan_San_Abbott · 5 January 2010, 01:51 PM

Hi Greybeard:
First of all being a member of IMPS does not necessarily make you reliable or accurate. All it means is you are amember of IMPS. Accuracy in reporting and a reliability of an authors work is earned by providing source data and is traceable. I don't know Rick Kent, I don't think I have read any of his work, so I am not qualified to comment on his work.
I try to give data source, so my reader can check it for him self. Very much so if it is a subject of question.
My response was, in all the photos of all the Nieuports, 11c1 through Nieuport 28c1, I checked, as a response of the supposed red bindings were light colored natural linen cord bindings. In a few ot the photos, the bindings appear darker, near a mid-grey, but they are not red. Red in orthrochromatic film is shown as near black. Sources: Nieuport Aircraft of World War One, J.M.Bruce;

French Aircraft of the First World War by James Davilla, Aurthur Zoltan.
Happy New Year,
Dan-San

Greybeard · 6 January 2010, 07:27 AM

I wrote to IPMS asking for evidence or Rick Kent's contact.

GB

davecww1 · 12 January 2010, 03:53 PM

Yes this is the first I have heard of Red tapes on the V struts. The latest research by Allan Toelle (I believe he examined an actual piece of a Nieuport 16 strut with the tape) was that the tapes were a horizon blue color similar to the French uniforms. This ws the same color used to outline the wings and tail surface. Also metal parts like struts and undercarrage were painted this same color similar to the paint used on the Adrian helmets. Profiles showing this scheme are shown in the Windsock Lafayette Flyers book as well as a couple of issues of Windsock magazines 2 or 3 years ago.
Dave

karrart · 12 January 2010, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davecww1

Yes this is the first I have heard of Red tapes on the V struts. The latest research by Allan Toule (I believe he examined an actual piece of a Nieuport 16 strut with the tape) was that the tapes were a horizon blue color similar to the French uniforms. This ws the same color used to outline the wings and tail surface. Also metal parts like struts and undercarrage were painted this same color similar to the paint used on the Adrian helmets. Profiles showing this scheme are shown in the Windsock Lafayette Flyers book as well as a couple of issues of Windsock magazines 2 or 3 years ago.
Dave

and also the latest Over the Front,winter 09- lots of Toelle and Toelle-driven Nieuport madness.
Robert Karr
new brain dribble at:
RK’s Pfalzhood - Pfalz, Halberstadt, Nieuport, CAMEL!!!