Fokker Dr.I Triplane German Cross Anomaly!

[gipsymoth236k]

I just found an interesting anomaly in this photo of Fokker Dr.I Triplane 423/17 (it's only two factory production numbers previous to the famous 425/17 Triplane that Manfred Von Richthofen was shot down in):



I had never seen this interesting photo of 423/17 before. It has a few details of interest! Notice the field modification of an aluminum cover over where the twin Spandau machine guns belong; unfinished German crosses on the top wing. But the most interesting detail is the subtle change in the German cross design. The arms of the crosses are straight-sided, not typically curved as seen here on Fokker Dr.I 146/17:



I'm now looking for more photos of this German cross anomaly on late production Dr.I Triplanes!

Regards,
Gary Sewall

['14-'18aviationcollector]

Hi Gary,

That's a great photo! Where did you find it? It never ceases to amaze me how often such anomolies are found. It sure would be nice to find out why the crosses were not standard, but it is almost certain that the explanation, which is probably relatively simple will never be known.

I did wonder, especially given the fact that the wing crosses are largely incomplete if it was photographed during or prior to flight testing, but I think it's unlikely due to the lack of evidence of other straight sided crosses applied to Fokker Triplanes. I'm sure I've seen similar crosses applied to very early WW1 German aeroplanes, but never to such a late aeroplane as a Fokker Triplane. I doubt that crosses were applied in the manner seen in your photo, and later touched up to become standard, although it is a possibility. It would take an excessive amount of white paint to change the sides of the cross from straight to the standard (for the time) curved cross arms, and I have certainly never seen any evidence of touching up / modification of the cross arms on the few original crosses from 425 / '17 I have been lucky enough to study at various times - although many of them have their own interesting history and anomolies which make the truth more difficult to uncover than it should be. I think, as you said that it was just an unusual exception to the rules, but who knows?

Very interesting!

Regards,

David.

[Hans]

I think it could be a training aircraft. Trainers are known to have non-regular paint jobs. And the a/c is not armed, but the gun opening is faired over.

H

[musec]

Hello,

The site at http://www.fokkerdr1.com/images/fokk...i%20423-17.jpg has the machine as belongng to a Jastaschule. Anyone know which one?


Regards,

Clint

[Laserlloyd]

Here is the data page for 423\17: Fokker Dr.I 423/17

Sorry Garry for not replying. I'm still vary tried from my treatments and this has been the first week back to work, (on the road) in seven weeks so when I get back to the hotel I'm just wipe out.

First off I don't think it would had passed the acceptance with that cross and when it was painted at the factory i don't believe that they would have done this to this plane even know that it was going to a Jastaschule.

It is my opinion that this was done there after it was delivered to the Jastaschule.

I will have to look to see with late production planes I have with a fresh factory Finnish.

Not sure if I can get to it tonight, I'm going to Russ's studio tonight.

Lloyd...

[Tim West]

I've seen this before but had never spent much time thinking about......Till Now!!

First, it's a nice image. I'd like to have a look at a higher res version but still this is not bad.

I bet the after market "deck and coping kit" snapped right onto the existing threaded panel post.
Or what ever they are called. Where the fokker nuts go. Lol

The cross doesn't match any production machines that I can see. That is with one exception.
The DVL Dr.I 528 can be seen sporting the same style cross on the fuselage. (circa mid 1930's)

I dont think they are related however. The crosses appear to have been made by simply drawing a
straight edge to opposite corners. Quick and easy, perhaps, if a stencil is not available.

Also, while earlier Fokker's can be seen with varying cross types....none I have seen, are like this one.

An anomaly for sure

The caption from Lloyd's site seems to match other information on 423. Other than the Jasta Schule
part. Not sure where that comes into the story.

I think that the photo was taken at the Fokker factory field. Maybe it was being tested by/at Bauaufsicht 13.
Perhaps it is the test pilot Weidner in the photo??

The crosses themselves were probably so as not to be shot at by friendlies on the ground.
Note the lack of crosses on the top wing. They would not have sent out a plane to an operational post
without them. Hence my thought that this is taken at Fokker.

Who knows. Cool photo still

[sobrien]

To my untrained eye it looks like there is the bottom of a cross and white field painted on the left aileron. Could this be a recovered wing?

Sean

[Tim West]

Originally Posted by sobrien

To my untrained eye it looks like there is the bottom of a cross and white field painted on the left aileron. Could this be a recovered wing?

Sean

Yeah good question....you can see crosses on both ailerons.
Is it a recovered wing or just a wing without crosses?

They didnt paint the cross fields, while the wings were mounted to the plane.
Well, I suppose they could tip the plane on its nose but that seems like a lame way to go about it. lol.

Other Fokker test craft and prototypes didnt carry crosses either. So,it's not unheard of.

I agree with Lloyd, I still think that if this plane was for anything other than "in house"
testing, it'd would have had a full regiment of markings.

Another note: 423 was "tested" 3 months after 425 was....in April.
This seems inconsistent with the other test and delivery dates for
the general range of Dr.I's. There is no listed delivery date for 423.

[SCMc]

According to Lloyd's website, Welcome To FokkerDR1.com - Research on the Fokker Dr.I, 423/17 was accepted on April 24,1917, and posted to a Jastaschule some time later. This is around the time that cross specs were changing. Is it possible that someone misinterpreted the new specs, or their orders to convert the iron cross to a "straight sided" cross. The lack of crosses or white fields on the upper wing could be consistent with a repaired wing at a Jastashule.

Tim,

What testing are you referring to three months after ... April.

Steve

[Hans]

Originally Posted by SCMc

423/17 was accepted on April 24,1917, and posted to a Jastaschule some time later.

April 18, you mean.
Jastaschulen rarely changed the Eiserne Kreuze to Balkenkreuze. There where machines flying in Nov. 18, still with Eiserne Kreuze.
Again, the strongest hint for a Jastaschule is the makeshift gun cover in front of the pilot

H