The Aerodrome Forum

Real Identity Albatros 23.56?

musec — Sat, 18 May 2013 17:14:30 GMT

Hello All,

I recently purchased Harry Woodman's WDF 118 Hansa Brandenburg D.I., on Page 18 there is a photo showing an aircraft marked 23.56 described as an Albatros B.I. Now admittedly I am writing this question after several pints of Staropramen, but Grosz, Haddow and Schiemer's magnum opus Austro-Hungarian Army Aircraft of World War One appears to contain no reference to Albatros 23.5 series aircraft. My question , am I just trashed or was the aircraft clearly marked in the photo as 23.56 mistakenly given the wrong code at the time or has my copy of the book missed aPhoenix produced series of the Albatros B.I? If the markings were misapplied at the time what should the aircraft's serial actually have been, I assume 24.56. Both sobriety and clarification much appreciated.

Regards,

Clint

Pioneers of Aerial Combat

jsontag — Sat, 18 May 2013 17:03:16 GMT

Came across this, due out in July from Pen & Sword Publishing. Pioneers of Aerial Combat: Air Battles of the First World War by Michael Foley

New DR1 movie--just released

hoodoo — Sat, 18 May 2013 01:07:52 GMT

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvUqkm8OEVM

:)

Breguet's 1939-1945 ID Challenge #254

Dave_Kent — Sat, 18 May 2013 00:27:58 GMT

For Your consideration

Dave

Scoreboard at the end of Challenge #253: AKAFLIEG GRAZ G 23 (Germany, 1941)

79.10 Dave_Kent
61.80 richard B
52.10 Rbailey
13.50 aerohydro
13.00 Froggy
11.00 Doc
************************
10.00 or higher must wait 12 hours
************************
09.00 YavorD
************************
5.00 to 9.99 must wait 6 hours
4.99 or lower may start immediately
************************
04.00 DHC2Pilot
03.00 Albatros Ace
02.00 Rod_Filan
02.00 Sobrien
02.00 Mark
01:00 Tork1945

Previous: Breguet's 1939-1945 Aircraft Challenge

The Rules:

1. The thread title must be "Breguet's 1939-1945 Aircraft ID Challenge #......".
2. The score board, link and rules must be copied to the beginning of each thread, so that we know where we are. The score board and the correct answer to the challenge must also be placed at end of each thread.
3. The completed aircraft must have been either; designed, built or have left the ground during the '39-'45 period and be identifiable by the poster.
4. The photo must show the whole aircraft - from whatever angle, or at least 2 views of a 3 view drawing (photo by preference).
5. Challenges which depict a machine already earlier presented are disqualified (always check the list at Aeroplanes 1939 - 1945* -* Breguet -Aircraft Challenge* -- when in doubt !).
6. If there is any doubt as to the eligibility of an aircraft for the challenge details should be PM'd to Breguet BEFORE the aircraft is submitted.
7. Once someone has got 5 correct answers under their belt they become an ACE. Once they become an ACE they must wait 6 hrs after the original post. When someone becomes a DOUBLE ACE (10 or more points) the must wait 12 hrs after the original post to ID the aircraft.

Attached Images

Next3945.jpg (57.8 KB)

Breguet's 1919-1939 Aircraft ID Challenge #320

Tork1945 — Fri, 17 May 2013 22:01:58 GMT

For your attention. Please give an exact identification as possible of this particular machine.

Scoreboard at the end of Challenge # 319: Ansaldo A.300/C (Italy, 1921)

70.10 richard B
55.70 Dave_Kent
48.90 Rbailey
30.10 Tork1945
26.50 Varese2002
14.00 YavorD
13.10 Froggy
09.00 aerohydro
08.00 DHC2Pilot
07.50 sobrien
06.80 Doc
**************
(those above this section must wait 12 hours before answering,
those below - and everyone else - may answer immediately)
**************
04.00 Kdmoo
03.00 Aquilius
03.00 Wind in The Wires
02.00 Albatros_Ace
02.00 Lodzermensch
02.00 Sreiko
01.00 JoeGertler

Previous: Breguet's 1919-1939 Aircraft ID Challenge

The Rules:

The thread title must be "Breguet's 1919-1939 Aircraft ID Challenge #......" AND must be placed in the Non-WWI Aviation sub-Forum.
The score board, link and rules must be copied to the beginning of each thread, so that we know where we are. The score board and the correct answer to the challenge must also be placed at end of each thread.
The completed aircraft must have been either; designed, built or have left the ground during the '1919-1939 period and be identifiable by the poster.
The photo must show the whole aircraft - from whatever angle, or at least 2 views of a 3 view drawing (photo by preference).
Challenges which depict a machine already earlier presented are disqualified (always check the list at Aeroplanes 1919-1939* -* Breguet's -Aircraft Challenge* -- when in doubt !).
If there is any doubt as to the eligibility of an aircraft for the challenge details should be PM'd to Breguet BEFORE the aircraft is submitted.
Once someone has gotten 5 correct answers under their belt they become an ACE. Once they become an ACE they must wait 12hrs after the posting of the new challenge before they can post an answer.
To be eligible for correct ID an answer must include at least one characteristic of the aircraft that helped in its identification.
The first person to ID the challenge correctly gets to post the next challenge. If this can not be done for any reason Breguet himself will post the next challenge.
If an ace gives the correct answer too early, the challenge is over, he gets no point but has to post the next one. In lieu of the fact that the "novices" have in effect been "cheated" of their "exclusive" time that next post should be a relatively easy one.
Anyone repeating the correct answer at the right time gets neither a point nor the right to post the next challenge.

Tork1945

Addendum
I realized this already quite some time ago, but for whatever reason the lists of previous Breguet Challenges has not been amended by the faithful Rod Filan, who is sadly away for a long time already on this Forum. The availability of these lists are a pre requisite to comply to the Breguet rules for these Challenges. Is there any hope that Mr. Filan will or can start with these lists ?

Robey and Music Hall Gramohone recordings

snj5 — Fri, 17 May 2013 13:48:18 GMT

I pulled the trigger on a Victrola today. By serial number, it is a 1915 Victrola IX. It is completely rebuilt and functional.
Now I need to find some George Robey or some WW1 music hall recordings... any British folks have a source on those?
Thanks!

Attached Images

IMG_1597_1.jpg (53.4 KB)

Info about these pilots

rampa — Fri, 17 May 2013 11:21:22 GMT

Hi all, this is my first message here, I'm looking for any info about the 2 pilots in the attached pdf. Their names: Otto and Felix (on the back) Weigel, the photo was taken in the year 1916 and the plane seems to be a Fokker EIII "Eindecker". Only Felix survived, Otto was killed in action in the same year 1916. The infos from the family in Germany are fragmented, the Felix's daughter (today 85 old), says that Felix and Otto were part of Von Richthofen Jagdgeshwader. Anyone expert of german squadrons can confirm this?
Thank you
Claudio

Attached Files

Nuovo documento 2.pdf (333.9 KB)

Aviation Mysteries of WWI

totalspoon — Fri, 17 May 2013 04:32:38 GMT

There are lots of mysteries from WWI that we still haven�t solved to this day. Here are three of my favourites. No one knows for sure what the answers are for these mysteries, but what�s YOUR theory???

1) German Triplane sightings between 24th September and Mid October 1917.

According to the German records, there were no Triplanes at the front after both Fokker F.I�s were shot down (15th and 23rd September) until the first Dr.I�s were delivered in mid-October. But many experience allied pilots continued to see triplanes in this gap. Most interestingly, on the afternoon of Oct 2 1917 Lts Muspratt and Rhys Davids, both very experience pilots of 56 Sqdn were in action with enemy scouts. Lt Muspratt reported he fought three enemy scouts, one of which he reported was a Triplane.
Rhys Davids, didn�t just note there were triplanes but took careful note and described them in his combat report. He stated he �saw two Fokker Triplanes, with no dihedral, large extensions, Nieuport tail, Fokker rudder and Martinsyde shaped wings, engine probably rotary. Climb appeared good.�

2) Double V-Strutters (Text taken straight from Alex Revell)

In late August and early September 1917 pilots began to report the sightings of what was called 'a double "V Strutter'. Both Hoidge and McCudden reported seeing this aeroplane. McCudden described it as having two bays to each wing instead of the usual one. 'This machine was known as the double V-Strutter and was supposed to be flown by Baron von Richthofen.' (Flying Fury page 185. Hamilton edition) Collett of 70 Squadron actually wrote a description of this aeroplane which he said was slightly larger than the Albatros it closely resembled, and even made a sketch of it for RFC HQ showing a double pair of wing struts each side of the fuselage. I was never successful in finding this sketch at the PRO. The pilots who made the sightings were all experienced pilots so they must have been correct on the two bay description and the double sets of struts.

3) Archie smoke columns

From �Cavalry of the Clouds� by Capt Alan Bott. During a patrol in 1916 he notes,

�Soon we were treated to a display by the family ghost of the clan Archibald, otherwise an immense pillar of grey-white smoky substance that appeared very suddenly to windward of us. It stretched up vertically from the ground to a height about level with ours, which was then only five and a half thousand feet. We watched it curiously as it stood in an unbending rigidity similar to that of a giant waxwork, cold, unnatural, stupidly implacable, half unbelievable and wholly ridiculous. At the top it sprayed round, like a stick of asparagus. For two or three months similar apparitions had been exhibited to us at rare intervals, nearly always in the same neighbourhood. At first sight the pillars of smoke seemed not to disperse, but after an interval they apparently faded away as mysteriously as they appeared. What was meant to be their particular branch of frightfulness I cannot say. One rumour was that they were an experiment in aerial gassing, and another that they were of some phosphorous compound. All I know is that they entertained us from time to time, with no apparent damage.�

What are your best guesses to solving these mysteries?

Spoon

Breguet's Aircraft ID Challenge #1164

totalspoon — Thu, 16 May 2013 22:20:29 GMT

Did a quick search and no seems to have tried this beast...

Scoreboard at the end of the Challenge #1163: LFG Roland D XVI

187.10 Dave_Kent ☼☼☼
158.45 Rbailey ☼☼☼
153.40 Varese2002 ☼☼☼
72.10 richard B ☼☼
45.60 Aquilius ☼
41.60 Tork1945☼
38.55 Lodzermensch ☼
33.30 Cruze ☼
30.58 Rod Filan ☼
27.50 YavorD ☼
24.75 Froggy
16.90 Flamingo
13.00 Breguet
10.50 matte_kudasai
10.45 GregE
10.30 Patrick
09.70 Dan-San
09.70 FOKKERJ Feuchtwanger
09.20 Rufe
08.40 Brad
08.40 JohnMacG
07.70 Berman
07.70 EdStevens
07.60 trp81
07.50 Doc
07.25 Ermeio
07.10 Colin A. Owers
06.70 Ampovandak
06.50 Albrecht
06.30 HoHun
06.10 Jim
06.10 '14-'18aviationcollector
06.10 joegertler
06.00 Eric Goedkoop
06.00 Old Man
06.00 Sobrien
05.80 RobW
05.70 vossiewulf
05.70 AROTH
05.70 dpolglaze
05.60 ercoupepilot
05.40 John McKenzie
05.30 Crimso
05.30 Der Gr�ne Flieger
05.20 Gilles
05.20 Maze
05.10 bshatzer
05.00 AL FORBES
05.00 Kristjanr
05.00 SCMc
05.00 Tom L

............Above this line, have to wait 12 hours
........... Below this line, may start immediately

04.40 Ross Moorhouse
04.30 edmondthieffry
04.00 Alex1965
04.00 greenknight
04.00 Luf-Rick
03.00 Catfish
03.00 Linhawk
02.50 Gregoire
02.50 Rexee
02.30 Cigogne
02.30 ckingh5
02.10 Crankcase
02.00 albatros1234
02.00 austin08
02.00 Lupodimontenero
02.00 Misa2
02.00 Rickenbaron
02.00 Totalspoon
01.70 Kilian
01.60 airplane176
01.60 sergio_vitalio
01.50 Albatros_Ace
01.20 Ransom E. Olds
01.00 Cliff
01.00 cubsfan4life
01.00 gregorydquist
01.00 Mike Westrop
01.00 missouri mule
01.00 paolomiana
01.00 Peter Zambori
01.00 rammjaeger
01.00 SL DIII
01.00 Tripehound
00.90 Stig Jarlevik
00.80 Machinbird
00.80 Mad Mac
00.80 tbstreet
00.80 toxisch
00.60 Sreiko
00.50 Douglas7
00.50 Martin Irvine
00.40 Johnnick
00.40 Vilkata
00.30 albapfalzd30
00.30 Miroslav Pokorny
00.30 Nieuport14
00.20 Paul_J._Fisher

The rules :

1. The thread title must be "Breguet's Aircraft ID Challenge #......"
2. The score board, link and rules must be copied to the beginning of each thread, so that we know where we are. The score board and the correct answer to the challenge must also be placed at end of each thread.
3. The completed aircraft must have been either; designed, built or have left the ground during the '14-'18 period and be identifiable by the poster.
4. The photo must show the whole aircraft - from whatever angle, or at least 2 views of a 3 view drawing (photo by preference).
5. Challenges which depict a machine already earlier presented are disqualified (always check the list at Aeroplanes 1914 - 1918* -* Breguet's Aircraft Challenge* -- when in doubt !) and the poster re-post within the same thread, the 12hours handicap beginning from that point.
6. If there is any doubt as to the eligibility of an aircraft for the challenge details should be PM'd to Breguet BEFORE the aircraft is submitted.
7. Once someone has got 5 correct answers under their belt they become an ACE. Once they become an ACE they must wait 12hrs after the posting of the new challenge before they can post an answer.
8. To be eligible for correct ID an answer must include at least one characteristic of the aircraft that helped in its identification.
9. The first person to ID the challenge correctly gets to post the next challenge. If this can not be done for any reason Breguet himself will post the next challenge.
10. If an ace gives the correct answer too early, the challenge is over, he gets no point but has to post the next one. In lieu of the fact that the "novices" have in effect been "cheated" of their "exclusive" time that next post should be a relatively easy one. Anyone repeating the correct answer at the right time gets neither a point nor the right to post the next challenge.
11. The final arbiter in relation to questions about the rules is BREGUET.

Breguet's 1939-1945 ID Challenge #253

richard B — Thu, 16 May 2013 18:52:44 GMT

Bonsoir

Two pictures , to complain with rule #4 :

[/URL]

[/URL]

PREVIOUS : Breguet's 1939-1945 Aircraft Challenge

GOOD LUCK !

Richard

Scoreboard at the end of Challenge #252: Zmaj R 1 (Yugoslavia, 1940)

78.10 Dave_Kent
61.80 richard B
52.10 Rbailey
13.50 aerohydro
13.00 Froggy
11.00 Doc
************************
10.00 or higher must wait 12 hours
************************
09.00 YavorD
************************
5.00 to 9.99 must wait 6 hours
4.99 or lower may start immediately
************************
04.00 DHC2Pilot
03.00 Albatros Ace
02.00 Rod_Filan
02.00 Sobrien
02.00 Mark
01:00 Tork1945

The Rules:

1. The thread title must be "Breguet's 1939-1945 Aircraft ID Challenge #......".
2. The score board, link and rules must be copied to the beginning of each thread, so that we know where we are. The score board and the correct answer to the challenge must also be placed at end of each thread.
3. The completed aircraft must have been either; designed, built or have left the ground during the '39-'45 period and be identifiable by the poster.
4. The photo must show the whole aircraft - from whatever angle, or at least 2 views of a 3 view drawing (photo by preference).
5. Challenges which depict a machine already earlier presented are disqualified (always check the list at Aeroplanes 1939 - 1945* -* Breguet -Aircraft Challenge* -- when in doubt !).
6. If there is any doubt as to the eligibility of an aircraft for the challenge details should be PM'd to Breguet BEFORE the aircraft is submitted.
7. Once someone has got 5 correct answers under their belt they become an ACE. Once they become an ACE they must wait 6 hrs after the original post. When someone becomes a DOUBLE ACE (10 or more points) the must wait 12 hrs after the original post to ID the aircraft.

Looking for more in the 1915 aerial history

VEDRINE — Thu, 16 May 2013 14:47:37 GMT

Hi everybody .

I have seen on this very good Youtube document , the story of Rolland Garros tinkering the mounting of a machine gun that can fire " on" the prop , with an armoured metal plate to protect prop's blades' root; It was telling that Garos got a true success with his system, but , due to an engine failure , he soon landed in german soil. The German captured his plane. Then a Dutch engineer from Fiesler , built the first device firing " through" the prop by synchronizing the firing with the prop's blade position.
Looking for more of this story , I read that this device was so efficient that the german planes got the total air superiority for 9 month in 1915.
What amazed me is these 9 month slaughtering of young allied pilots without any technical reply !! 9 month is a very long time in this case .And the HQ didn't seem too concerned by curing the problem by any other mean than sending more of young guys of 19 , to a sure death .These 9 month are an actual accusation of guilt for the war managers !
Pilots with a total of less than 10 flight training hours ,when taking off for combat. Some of these had enough difficulties only to fly such planes,and could crash without any help...like being fired at , by "old"* & efficient german pilots with superior machines ! They had not a single chance to survive.
Please , does anyone know where I can find issues & details about this time & facts.?
It always turns me angry when I study this war , how some high rank officers from the Etat-Major were utterly carefree about soldiers' death ! And - I know the word is not weak- but how many of those HQ'officers & patriotic medal bearers were often merely stupid & cowards !. The story of the parachutes and the one of "Fort de Vaux " , forinstance , prove it .

Well, where could I find more details ? The name of the first german plane fitted with axial guns ( Albatros , or Aviatik, fokker ???) .
Stories of survivors from this time ( as in the small Youtube film )
Hints about the difficulties of piloting these planes , with 5 hours on other plane's type , and without former pilots to brief you ( there was NO former pilots ,all being killed too quickly !) all the flaws of these machines, and engines had to be discovered on the spot , and quickly enough to avoid being killed by them...
How the young pilots had to learn quickly ** the basic things to stay alive ...It's a part of the history which remains very difficult to print !

* No one were old ,among the true combatants. Only those from rear could grow "old".
** "Learn quickly " My Grand father who survived the whole war as " grenadier voltigeur" ( few day's of life time's hope in 1917) just told me this : those who couldn't learn quick enough about all that was made to kill you , had no chance. It was necessary to learn and anticipate quicker than shrapnels, as far it was possible without any information.

Lynn Williams and the Flitzer

snj5 — Thu, 16 May 2013 12:21:58 GMT

One of the builder's groups I lurk and follow with regularity for its wonderful instructional value in construction and flying is Welshman Lynn Willam's Flitzer group. The Flitzer is a family of small single seat wooden biplanes powered by VWs up through a Rotec R-2800. He is a terrific guy, and is quite expert at explaining technical issues, many which also apply to our little kites.

In a discussion on approach speed today, here's a quote from Lynn Williams citing Yates - Mr. Williams truly 'gets it'. Highly recommend the Yahoo Flitzer Group.

Quote:

Like the pilots of the Great War and the subsequent decade and a half, the elemental joys so profoundly described by Yates as 'that lonely impulse of delight', cannot be matched for its heady sensations, speed, the rush and tear of slipstream, the snarl of the open exhausts, the turning landscape framed by wings, struts and criss-crossed by bar-tight wires; the endless desire to roll and bank, to zoom and manoeuvre, exulting in control power and feedback - it really talks to you - that's the Flitzer experience. It's more than an aeroplane. It seems alive; you and it are one and you will find that statement is no clich�. You will learn to trust its predictable behaviour, its readiness to respond to the slightest touch, allowing you to make gross mistakes with impunity.
But always remember, it's no toy. All aeroplanes in situations can be unforgiving if you press your luck too low, too slow, in sink or curlover, and you'd have just that brief moment of regret that it was the pilot and not the aeroplane that failed that time.

Better PHOTOS

sashav — Thu, 16 May 2013 02:01:24 GMT

Thanks JAY,
I went to Walmart and spend one hour scanning, I hope it is worth it.
Sasha

Attached Images

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Zeppelin paperback

SteveH — Wed, 15 May 2013 23:26:23 GMT

Many years ago, in the seventies, I purchased a book that covered German airship operations. Not just the Navy, this book covered the Army as well, all fronts, Western, Eastern and Balkans as well as the epic African flight. I lost it during a house move and have been unable to source a replacement. The authors name is long gone from memory so can anyone help to identify this book.

Regards, Steve

Breguet's 1939-1945 Aircraft ID Challenge #252

Dave_Kent — Wed, 15 May 2013 18:43:07 GMT

For your consideration

Dave

Scoreboard at the end of Challenge #251: Operation Outward balloons (England, 1942)

78.10 Dave_Kent
60.80 richard B
52.10 Rbailey
13.50 aerohydro
13.00 Froggy
11.00 Doc
************************
10.00 or higher must wait 12 hours
************************
09.00 YavorD
************************
5.00 to 9.99 must wait 6 hours
4.99 or lower may start immediately
************************
04.00 DHC2Pilot
03.00 Albatros Ace
02.00 Rod_Filan
02.00 Sobrien
02.00 Mark
01:00 Tork1945

Previous: Breguet's 1939-1945 Aircraft Challenge

The Rules:

1. The thread title must be "Breguet's 1939-1945 Aircraft ID Challenge #......".
2. The score board, link and rules must be copied to the beginning of each thread, so that we know where we are. The score board and the correct answer to the challenge must also be placed at end of each thread.
3. The completed aircraft must have been either; designed, built or have left the ground during the '39-'45 period and be identifiable by the poster.
4. The photo must show the whole aircraft - from whatever angle, or at least 2 views of a 3 view drawing (photo by preference).
5. Challenges which depict a machine already earlier presented are disqualified (always check the list at Aeroplanes 1939 - 1945* -* Breguet -Aircraft Challenge* -- when in doubt !).
6. If there is any doubt as to the eligibility of an aircraft for the challenge details should be PM'd to Breguet BEFORE the aircraft is submitted.
7. Once someone has got 5 correct answers under their belt they become an ACE. Once they become an ACE they must wait 6 hrs after the original post. When someone becomes a DOUBLE ACE (10 or more points) the must wait 12 hrs after the original post to ID the aircraft.

Attached Images

Next3945.jpg (52.3 KB)