Aces Cigarette Case, MvR, Udet, etc.

[Aerowallah]

PS Everyone on the right hand side survived, so there is no tip off in KIA names placed out-of-sequence from top to bottom.

[GMU]

Unfortunately, all you need is period silverware, the right signature and a moderately competent engraver....

Without credible provenance information........one must be careful.

[Gregvan]

Hi,

I can make no statement about whether or not this cigarette case is genuine, having looked at it as Dave Watts asked. Such engraved cases were fairly common, as these things go. I have never seen the figure-on-a-swallow emblem anywhere. It's certainly not a Jasta emblem.

The engraved Pfalz logo makes me wonder if this was owned by somebody well-placed in the Pfalz firm (maybe one of the Eversbusch brothers themselves?). However, I have NO info or opinion on whether or not this was the case. Such people certainly had plenty of contact with high-scoring aces during the various fighter competitions, and during the visits to the Pfalz factory in Speyer by various aces (MvR included). The Eversbusch brothers put on lavish banquets for the fliers at the Fighter Competitions (which on one occasion included entertainment by a famous dancer, Lucy Kieselhausen -IIRC - who was paid to dance in the nude for the thunderstruck young bloods), and certainly enjoyed being photographed with them.

Apparently, though, the seller makes no such claims. As many have said, it would be very nice to have confirmed provenance for such an item.

Greg VanWyngarden

[Aerowallah]

Skepticism is warranted. But come to think of it, I've seen fake autographs on Sankes, and fake engravings on flying badges, but never a demonstrably bad cigarette case--however, the big numbers these things are getting at HH may change all that. My gut says this is good--too many nice quality touches. Has anyone asked to see hallmarks? Also, given what winged warrior said, MvR and RvS should be done by different hands, if perceptible.

[Aerowallah]

This is the closest so far I've been able to come to that bird/archer motif...!

http://winshop.com.au/annew/Aquila.html

[wulffo]

The L in the word Pfalz is the wrong way around MvR would not sign his own case and v Schleich became v Schleich after MvR was dead....my guess it is a nice probably period case worth USD200-300 turned into something that would fetch 2000-3000 am thoroughly upset by this alteration recreation and faking business.

[wulffo]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...Pr4_PcY_BID_IT here is another one nice signature on a repro card ;o(

[FliegerJG1]

Hello Wulffo,

This repro card w/signature is something that I've seen often on eBay. There must be a number of them out there.

FliegerJG1

[Aerowallah]

Originally Posted by wulffo

The L in the word Pfalz is the wrong way around MvR would not sign his own case and v Schleich became v Schleich after MvR was dead....

We talked about this already, Wulffo. MvR would sign somebody else's case. RvS signed it after MvR's death, just as cases like these had signatures added over the years.



I wouldn't say the L is the wrong way, but there certainly are lots of little liberties done engraving the logo. That tells me this wasn't a Pfalz gift or they would've insisted on a faithful rendering of their own logo.

[Aerowallah]

Oh, oh! I emailed the vendor for a close-up of the gold hallmarks, and he emailed back...


Hello,
but sorry, it is in bank tresor and I do not come to it till the auction is over.
Maybe I bid over myself and resell it later with more details.
Kind regards
BZ