So whats the Red Baron film like?

Epee · 20 November 2009, 06:33 AM

Coo-Coo-Kachoo

Another historical personality I find fascinating is Wyatt Earp. He and MvR have many things in common biographically speaking; both have been portrayed as hero or villain, both have brothers who figure heavily into their stories, of course both are mainly known for their "warrior" abilities, both seem steadfastly determined to the point of ruthlessness for good or ill (by ruthless I mean without romanticism or sentimentality yet not cruel beyond what is called for), both are figures that symbolically imply grave but yet restrained menace.

In my opinion it took about 110 years for Wyatt Earp to get a fair "biographical" treatment in film and it came with 2 films in successive years. "Tombstone", which depicts the events around the OK Corral shootout terms relating to modern gang violence, is an uneven but thoroughly enjoyable, stereotypical Western with really great sets and period correct costuming to a fault. "Wyatt Earp" is more biographical, slow and hard to watch if interrupted with commercials, offering different interpretations of personalities (both films emphasize different traits), is less correct costuming wise, and themes the fluctuations and hardening of character over a lifetime. Before these movies came out Wyatt Earp, like MvR, was a Hollywood stock character; everyone recognizes the name and what is implied (a bada**) and the movie's story can movie forward all the faster because now you don't have to explain or develop a new character.

I remain in hope that someday in the not too distant future we'll see MvR get the combined treatment that Wyatt Earp got in 1993-94.

Geschwaderfuhrer · 24 November 2009, 07:52 PM

My name is Thomas, I designed ALL of the aircraft on the Red Baron feature, and gave all of the initial texture maps to Pixomondo. Obviously, I love the genre as much as all of you. But please do not speak to the film as if you know JACK, about making a feature.
With that said, I will maintain my position that The Red baron is the greatest WW1 aviation film to date. Be advised that it is actually an ANTI-WAR film, surprising as it may be, considering that, that is not what you would expect. Especially since no one up to this point has had the balls to do a film like this.... but hey, if you don't get it, you don't get it....

rainbase · 24 November 2009, 08:01 PM

Thomas, your work for the Red Baron film is amazing. In my opinion, these are the best looking aircraft in any of the WWI flying movies. Congratulations!

Chapay · 24 November 2009, 08:50 PM

I think the "Red Baron" is the best Film about German pilot, from the "Blue Max" period !
P.S. And the best film about France pilot is Angel`s Wing

Baron Von Quinnthar · 25 November 2009, 01:03 AM

Hi Thomas you might have known that I've been saying the same thing, Great work, The best aviation special effects ever in any film, Truely inspirational, I first came upon it when one of my family members decided to release the film on DVD and Blu-ray in australia. He showed it to me and I said to him this is outstanding you must release it. His company bought the rights and its been very well recieved by the DVD industry here in Australia and is getting the feature billing around the country it deserves. Some people may say I have had a vested interest in expressing my love for this film but it has truely inspired me back into my lost hobby of doing ww1 models and playing ww1 flight sims as well. So for a film to have that effect on someone , I think is truely inspiring. To all those nay sayers out there that hang crap on this film, I say this" Loosen up, let go, and relax and try to enjoy something thats right up your ally that is if your into ww1 aviation and if you cant do that well, there will be no pleasing you. Thomas, thankyou for the great work, and like i said the dvd industry in Australia has given it a big thumbs up, and many people have been very impressed, The interesting thing is most of these people aren't into ww1 aviation like us but like films and see alot of films and alot of them truely loved it. The Bluray coming out in australia which is great, with heaps of extras.

Cheers

Epee · 25 November 2009, 04:34 AM

Thomas,
Cheers to you and your compatriots! The aircraft depicted in "The Red Baron" are second to none and you deserve an Oscar for your work.

If I'm a bit critical of the film it's because I'm passionate about the subject but I also realize that all cinema is a compromise with time in an effort to tell a story and in my last post to this thread I implied that the subject needs longer developement a'la "Wyatt Earp". Three cheers that anyone is willing to try telling the tale of MvR.

I'm truely sorry that the film has taken so long to make it into the American market. It is on my short list of DVD purchases in the near future.

rexee · 25 November 2009, 07:56 AM

Thomas

Congratulations on your excellent work !

Rexee

ONEALM · 25 November 2009, 08:33 AM

I just recently saw this film and IMHO it has only one major flaw - but it's the basis for all the other things that we find both right and wrong with it.

The film has one foot in reality and one foot in fantasy-land.

How can you take historicaly accurate characters - Brown, most of Jasta 11,

Lanoe Hawker, etc., get their names right, get many of the technical details of costuming & setting right - even down to naming airfields at Cappy and La Brayelle -, go through some trouble to actors who even bear a passing resemblence to the real men and then completely whiff on the history

If you are going to do a WW I fantasy piece, do that. Don't use real people, places and situations and put them completely out of their historical context.

If you are going to make a history piece do that - get Lanoe Hawker in a DH-2, ditch his beard, take away the SPA 94 unit insignia, put vR in a D.II, make the Jasta 11 aircraft all Jasta 11 aircraft, not some mish-mash of neat and mostly accurate markings from other units, get Brown a pair of googles, ditch the in-flight harmonica - you know - get the facts right.

I liked most of the CG though some of it seems a little fast, but the fact that you had a whole Kette of Albatroses together, lots of Triplanes and a good mix of Allied airplanes was pretty neat and as a pilot, I can say in alot of cases pretty convincing.

All of the railing about the historical inaccuracies could be completely avoided if the film did not have one foot planted in "real" history.

Like FlyBoys, I enjoyed it more the second watching since I knew what was coming, but just like FlyBoys I was disappointed that the opportunity to make a visually appealing and historically accurate portrayal of vR and JG I was missed.

Geshwaderfuhrer is right - I don't know jack about making films, feature or otherwise. Not sure that's required for the consumer of the end product. But I do know that anyone with a understanding of the real history behind the characters portrayed was cringing and probably asking themselves the same basic question I was - what was the purpose of mixing fantasy and reality when it was an easy mark to get the history (completely) right?

Gregvan · 25 November 2009, 03:54 PM

Mike,

You've expressed my own feelings about this film almost exactly - and done it better than I could have. My feelings parallel your own almost 100%.

I, too, don't know jack about film-making. It just does seem like such a lost opportunity.

Greg

Colin A Owers · 27 November 2009, 12:12 PM

Well, I can only repeat what my old mate, Bill Toohey, said after I lent him the "Red baron" - I will have to throw all my books out and start over again - if that is anything like history.

Forgetting history, the movie was not entertaining and therefore it was a failure. "Flyboys" was entertaining and therefore a success - as a MOVIE.

Colin A Owers