Rhinebeck Museum trouble

[tazbat]

Congratulations Carroll on your foresight, in incorporating "Old Rhinebeck Aerodrome, Inc." Best wishes on your next moves.

Will Joe Gertler be good for ORA? Time will tell.

It doesn't take long for any of them to show their colors.

Salute!
Sandy

[joegertler]

Just for a clarification. so no one else should suffer from my personal actions and decisions.
I did say We,ORA and I were discussing the possibility of my going to ORA. We both left the matter on the table. When I returned home
I thought it important to see if I could find a solution to the satisfation of both parties,on the name issue before MY part of the ORA position decision was decided, My discussion centered on MY take on the matters, and how we might try to make ORA and other parties feel they could have a positive result, I said if it looked like there could be a solution, I would want to take the postion and expect to go back and finalize any soloution that BOTH parties agreed to IF that happened. It did not.

When I was at Old Rhinebeck, Nor at any other time or place, NO one there or elsewhere ever mentioned anything to do with any Boycott. When I returned home the idea was completely mine, I did not discuss it EVER with people at ORA. It was mine, and I must agree that it was not a good idea. I realize it was terrible idea, and I could not be more sorry about it.
I feel even WORSE if ANYone or ORA itself was ever adversely
affected by my personal consideration of it. Even Before I Phoned to withdraw my personal, singular, WWI aero membership and subscription, I knew it was a mistake I cannot forgive myself for allowing mySELF to have hurt the feelings of Leo Opdycke a friend (I /m not worthy of) for 44 years is something I don't think I can ever forgive myself for. Fortunatley, I did NOT ask one other person to do so. I haveasked Leo to re-subsribe me.
I had already decided ORA and myself are NOT a good fit. I have no idea what they have decided. I DID tell them earlier, that I had NO desire to come up there and jump into this stress. I was NOT being paid or directed by
anyone at Rhinebeck, as I wanted to remain a private individual, in these talks
Before making any further decision. They should NOT have to pay for MY mistake. please.

[cfgray]

If anyone connected with the current operation at Rhinebeck should be reading these posts, please be aware that our corporation name "OLD RHINEBECK AERODROME, INC." which was granted to us by New York State Department of State on 17 August 2006, is available for licensing.

We would be pleased to offer its use to the current operation at Rhinebeck under a licensing agreement, at a cost of $1 per year, reviewable and renewable each calendar year. The terms of the licensing agreement, like all licensing agreements, will specify what needs to be done by the licensee (Rhinebeck) to ensure that no harm comes to our good corporate name and under what conditions that usage may continue.

If there is a serious desire on the part of the current operation at Rhinebeck to be able to legally use our New York State approved corporate name, a letter expressing interest should be sent as soon as possible. Any non-licensed usage of our corporation's name is, as a legal necessity, forbidden.

That letter, signed by both Museum President Heimbach and Airshows President Schoelzel, inquiring about the possibility of licensing our good corporate name, OLD RHINEBECK AERODROME, INC., should be mailed to our corporation's mailing address, OLD RHINEBECK AERODROME, INC., Post Office Box 715, Red Hook, New York 12571.

We have had two other inquiries about licensing our good corporate name and wish to grant only one exclusive use per year. A decision will need to be made shortly about the entity to which we shall grant the license.

Best wishes,
cfgray

[wingnut]

Saturday, I took a trip to see a friend in rhinebeck. No, I did not go to the Aerodrome. That would give me a very bad feeling. I wanted to keep my trip on a good note. But I did see the Triplane flying over head at my friends house. It sounded real bad. Backfiring, coughing. Nice maintence boys! The Board must go. No negotiations. No deals. Just remove them!

[ONEALM]

CFG -

Your well placed plea...

We would be pleased to offer its use to the current operation at Rhinebeck under a licensing agreement, at a cost of $1 per year, reviewable and renewable each calendar year. The terms of the licensing agreement, like all licensing agreements, will specify what needs to be done by the licensee (Rhinebeck) to ensure that no harm comes to our good corporate name and under what conditions that usage may continue.

...reminds me of a great line from Ghostbusters. When they are trying to get Zule (or Zoole) to go back to wherever she came from, Dan Akroyd delivers a nice, politely worded request....which Bill Murray follows up with a sarcastic "That ought to do it Ray" Zule promptly ignores them.

I suspect the Rocket Scientists now running ORA will also ignore (as they have all reasonable prior request) this request.

[tazbat]

Originally Posted by wingnut

Saturday, I took a trip to see a friend in rhinebeck. No, I did not go to the Aerodrome. That would give me a very bad feeling. I wanted to keep my trip on a good note. But I did see the Triplane flying over head at my friends house. It sounded real bad. Backfiring, coughing. Nice maintence boys! The Board must go. No negotiations. No deals. Just remove them!

And yet they still flew it, despite its poor performance? Bad decision. Not much better than putting an inexperienced pilot in the seat of the Camel.

Salute!
Sandy

nextstar 7

wasn't kc that crashed the 504

[NexStar7]

KC was filming a segment for the Discovery Channel when the LeRhone gave up the ghost and he put it in the parking lot near the museum buildings. I talked to him about it while he was still at the aerodrome, trust me... he was the pilot when it went in! And if you don't trust me, ask him directly about it, he'll tell you the same thing.

[SteveS]

Forgive me if I’m wrong, but I think the point Loop.dee.Loop is trying to make is that Ken Cassens was the pilot in the crash. Some snippets from the FAA database might help clear up his question.

According to the FAA files on the Avro 504 crash, the FAA lists the probable cause as: “A total loss of engine power during the initial climb for undetermined reasons.”

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?e...10X00834&key=1

Whereas the FAA files on the Camel list the probable cause as “The pilot's failure to maintain aircraft control during the takeoff roll.”

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?e...09X00741&key=1

As far as I can tell the FAA isn't concerned with Ken Cassen's ability and experience as a pilot.

And one thing has always bothered me in the Camel crash file is this phrase:

“Assisted by a flight instructor who was "highly experienced in the same make and model…”

Anyone have any ideas on just how true this statement to the FAA was and who that might have been?

And while we are on the subject of crashed planes, The June 2007 issue of the Peachtree Aerodrome newsletter has an article on the Georgia New Standard. Seems it won’t be hopping rides opening weekend as stated by Trustee Hugh Schoelzel. It will still be in Georgia for their June 30th fly-in. According to the newsletter, it will be flown back later to ORA later this summer.

Check it out at:
http://www.peachstateaero.com/dotnet...Newsletter.pdf

Salute,
Steve

[tazbat]

Right 'O Nexstar and Steve!
KC was the attending pilot and good thing. The damage might have been far worse or the landing spot not as accomodating. I thought the AVRO went down in the soccer field area over the east hill. But, I didn't get to talk with KC about that. Not sure who I did talk to about it now, since that was a few years back.

I do remember KC saying what he suspected as the reason for the power loss. But, at this point that is all water under the bridge.

We can only hope that the same pilot who toasted the Camel, doesn't get the liberty to fly the 504. ORA is running out of rotary powered aircraft, the one item that for decades attracted so many people and kept them returning. For years, ORA was the only place on the face of the earth where you could see planes powered by rotary engines, and regularly every weekend during the air show seasons. And even when other living museums started up and flew their one or two rotary aircraft, Cole was flying three, or more. ORA has probably flown more varied rotary aircraft, than any other museum in the world, and maybe more than all of them together. But, look at it now...

I heard from a very reliable source within ORA (only a week after the crash), that the training pilot of the one who crashed the Camel was none other than Chad Wille. I also remember that there was a sizable rift between Jim and Chad at that time.

Salute!
Sandy