Rhinebeck Museum trouble

We'll have to get this "Special Events" listed on the oldrhinebeck.org website. This will be such a special event that media coverage would be nice, too!

Maybe we should do the Ex-volunteer and Ex-employee day on one of the Special Event days, like the Model Show Weekend. That way, we'll be guaranteed to already have a good size crowd and friends watching former Aerodromers getting escorted about the place.

[rc-notyme]

I really like the ex-volunteer/employee/media attendance idea.
Is this "list" something like a ten most wanted FBI list? Or should I say most UNwanted list ? Have we made the U.S. Post Office wall of fame yet?....I am pretty sure I am on the list - I will be greatly offended if I am not.
So we need an escort now......how paranoid and pathetic is that !!??
Dick - you have the right idea...... can I go too ?
Scott

I was at ORA yesterday for the third time in my life, so understand that I do not have a broad range of past experience to compare to. However, while there were some problems, things were not as bad as I expected from what I have been reading. I have heard complaints about the new announcer, and these are mostly justified: he is new and not very good right now. There were some mistakes, but he really didn't shout about the gift shop too much, and seemed to be enjoying himself at least. I have also heard complaints about the show itself; I feel that the quality is still high in this area, compared to what I have seen in years past. They had three and four planes in the air at one time, and true to form during the show I didn't even know where to look what with all the things going on in the ground and sky. There have also been complaints about the pilots being 'behind the fence'. Yesterday, they were allowing kids (and big kids such as myself&#33 on the other side of the fence to get a closer look at the planes (I was even allowed to sit in the Fokker Dr. 1).
Most importantly, I feel that there are many there who still try to make Cole Palen's dream live on. I was speaking to the new Black Baron that people were talking about. He is in fact a pilot. What really hit home to me though, was when he said that of all the Black Barons through the years, he said he has gone back to Cole Palen as the model of the way it should be done, and in a sense, it sounded as if he was trying to fill those very big shoes. Also, while there is a large cutout of Stanley Segalla in the museum, I also counted four prominent pictures featuring Cole before I even noticed the flying farmer.
In conclusion, while all might not be as well as we would like it, things are not as bad as it may seem. Of course, I am also responding to older posts, so please view this as more of an update than a hostile argument. I will keep looking for info from people more 'in the loop', and I still feel that the efforts to start funds and such that have been discussed are extremely worthwhile. Better safe than sorry when it comes to someplace as great as ORA.

[rc-notyme]

Blue Baron-
Thanks for the observations. I appreciate your perspective. I would be watching the show with conciderably less objectivity than you. Speaking for myself, the jibes and criticisms are directed at mr. daily et al - NOTat the new performers. Many of them are sincere and truly excited about working in the show. These individuals may not have any idea what is going on behind the scenes and I believe, have been fed just enough about the "bitter old timers" so that they won't ask questions. I also believe that mr. daley et al have made it perfectly clear to them that no questions will be tolerated. It should be interesting to see who is still a member of the troupe at seasons end. As for the new announcers - I don't know who they are or under what pretense they were put there - they CANNOT emulate Jim Hare- no one can. They should be educating themselves about their subject and then develope their own style. Mike Fischer, Gorden Bainbridge and Jim Hare each evolved into unique announcers. Sure there was the occassional gaff. But each of them knew their subject thoroughly. They also knew how to laugh WITH the crowd and at themselves. They never tried to copy anyone.
Read back through the forum and you will understand why we feel the way we do.

bluebaron- Thanks for your observations. It shows that the new crew has been reading this forum, knowing that they are being watched, and responding to what is posted. Thus, your experience seems to be quite different from the earlier shows seen by Matty B, Steve S, and others.

No matter how much better the show may improve, it does not negate all the terrible things done to so many people who worked there. It is one thing to act like Cole did on the field, it is quite another to have his morals, values, and code of ethics. The Aerodrome was hostilely taken over; dedicated people were forced out and they use Cole Palen's name only when it serves them. To the rest of us, Jim Kick and Tom Daly told us "Cole is dead."

As to the "list," they should take stock of themselves and their own past records. As rc-notyme suggests, anyone new to this thread should read through all these forum postings

"The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil, but because of those who look on and do nothing."- Albert Einstein

I understand completely where you are coming from: from what I have heard, there are some grave injustices going on behind the scenes; I just wanted to say that it is still a good time to go there. I appreciate where the 'old timers' are coming from. I have read Gordon Bainbridges book numerous times, and I really cherish the vision of Cole Palen, even though I never was there in his lifetime. I was upset to learn that things were no longer like "the good old days", and I hope that this is just going to be 'a low among a high point'. If I knew more or had more experience I would do my best to organize in some form; if someone were to do this I would be more than willing to add some young blood and energy to the mix.

[rc-notyme]

Blue Baron

Open minds and eyes are always welcome. Glad you had a good time. It IS fun to watch old planes- even after 45 years.
I hope the new crew ( I mean "young types" cp ) won't get in trouble for caring enough learn. Like I said - it will be interesting to see who is left at seasons end.

On a related note to forty five years: I am interested in learning more about times past at ORA: any suggestions of sources of information besides Gordon Bainbridges book? Any information on who to contact etcetera would be greatly appreciated. Someday I hope to help carry on with the dream, and I would like to have information to pass on even if just to family and friends. (Also, before handling a problem you should know what has changed.)

Three posts from a new guy is enough for one day, sorry to write so much.

[timjnf]

...suggestions of sources of information besides Gordon Bainbridges book?

Maybe I should have posted this in the Book Reviews section, but as it was mentioned here and this is a heavily travelled thread, and anyone who keeps checking this thread is obviously an ORA fan...

Is Gordon Bainbridges book very good?

I had not heard of it before, and I guess it's out-o-print, but there are some used copies for sale in the $70 arena.

$70 is more than I like to spend for books (it's an hour of flight time after all,) but if it's really good, my love of ORA will probably compel me to dole it out.

Also, since we're at it, how is "Wind in the Wires, A Golden Age of Flight" by Mike Vines?
I have his "Return to Rhinebeck" already, is it worth having both?
Any thoughts on this? Anyone??

Thanks,
Tim

As someone with little actual experience with ORA, I can say that whenever I need a pick-me-up, his book is one of the few that gets my head in the clouds in a heartbeat. As far as I can tell, it really does justice to the original vision of the aerodrome. It seems that a lot of people feel that this vision has been lost lately, and I think that reading Bainbridge's book is a great way to revive the old days.

Someone posted earlier that it is one thing to imitate Cole Palen on the field and another to embody everything that he stood for. Even though I never experienced it, I feel as if I knew exactly what this person was talking about from reading "The Old Rhinebeck Aerodrome". Well worth the money.