radio in planes?

[tegan_]

Im a newbie and I know radio came in about 1914-1916 - would there have been radios in WWI aircraft?
thanks!

[Buzzard]

The Se-5A for one had a radio box aft of the cockpit on the right side. I believe it contained a code key for the pilot to send information in morse code. I am a not an expert on the issue, but the reproduction I fly does have the box. We do not have the radio and I cannot provide any information on that

[Testerchild]

Hi Tegan,

Welcome to the forum. Radio (or wireless as they called it then) was carried in some aircraft of both sides in WW1. I don't know which was the first machine to carry it, or when, but it was certainly being used by RFC recce types such as the BE2 and FE2b in early 1916. This was a morse transmitter so that that recce crews could pass target details to ground batteries. 20 Squadron RFC were experimenting with two-way morse transmitter-recievers in early 1916, and I think other units probably were too, at the request of HQ. Two-way speech, or R/T, sets started to appear in 1918, but I don't know how widely they were used.

I'm sure other forumites have more info.

Bob

[StephenLawson]

I believe in SE 5a Fighter Supreme, Alex Revell said that no war time SE 5a ever employed the radio. He is the expert. Transmitters and later Radio transceivers were used especially on two seater aircraft.

[McKeever]

Most English recon aircraft including the Brisfit, Harry Tate, Quirk, Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter, FE2, and DH4 used wireless transmitters. Vocal communication was never used. The RFC observers began to improve morse code skills in early 1917 so they could tap out 12 to 16 words a minute. They communicated with artillery batteries and provided coordinates and commencing orders to the guns. Ground stations near the front lines would monitor the airwave traffic to weed out any transmission issues. The communcation at first was one way. The ground units would have to use large ground signals to confirm messages.
No. 40 and No. 16 Squadrons were equipped with wireless comm in 1917 I believe.

[Graeme]

Don't think No 40 Squadron would have used wireless sets in their Nieuports.

Graeme

[pvernon]

IIRC and I cannot remember what the source was. In late 1915 early 1916 the RFC borrowed some voice radio sets from the RN and put them in some 2 seaters (the source mentioned which squadron) and experimented with plane to plane communication, by late 1917 they had some lighter radios and were working on squadron sized radio tests to work out plane to plane and plane to ground protocols. In mid 1918 they had an even lighter set and had added an SE5a unit to their experiment and were trying to figure out how to do multiple unit inflight coordination. They had not progressed to the point of a combat test at the end of the war, but were talking about it.

I wish I had noted the source.

[Graeme]

I believe the source was an article by Nick Forder in Cross and Cockade International - I'll see if I can track down which issue, late 2002 or early 2003, I think.

The notes I have to hand are ... "the RFC began trials with wireless telgraphy and aircraft at Cramlington in 1916. On 21 November 1916, 2nd Lt Douglas received a W/T message 24 miles from the transmitter. Developments were interrupted due to bureaucrarcy and difficulties with the Admiralty, which was supplying the equipment. The Admiralty feared that W/T would interfere with the Marconi Direction Finding Stations.

Early in 1917 the trials unit moved to Biggin Hill and was tasked to develop air-to-ground and air-to-air direct speech communication (radio telegraphy) as a priority. Tests were carried out elsewhere and in September 1917 the first successful air-to-air R/T communication was carried out by Bristol Fighters of 11 Squadron. As a result of this two two-seater squadrons (Biffs ?) were equipped with the system. A ground-to-air long range transmitter was set up at Aplefield (I think this should be Aperfield) Court, a mile south east of Biggin.

Using this system Bristol Fighters of 141 Squadron took part in successful trials in April 1918. In May 1918, 143 Squadron SE5as and 141 Squadron Biffs were fitted with the system and used operationally against German daylight raids on Britain. The development and trials unit later moved from Biggin to Penhurst."

Graeme

[Testerchild]

One experiment with wireless telephony is recorded in 'The War in the Air' Volume 6, page 464, but not between aircraft:although I'm sure I have read of such experiments somewhere. The W/T experiment in WITA was from aircraft to tanks, of all things, in the run-up to the Battle of Amiens in 1918.

"Experiments were made with wireless telephony by which the air observers might communicate information, but it was found that talk from the air could be heard inside a tank only under the most favourable conditions and so long as the aeroplane was within a quarter of a mile of the tank at a height not greater than 500 feet...At the end of July tests with wireless telegraphy (i.e. morse code) proved successful, with messages being clearly received in the tanks from aeroplanes which were 9,000 yards away and at 2,500 feet altitude."
I'm hunting for some more references I'm sure I have somewhere, and will add to the above if I find them!

[McKeever]

My apologies on the error, I meant 48 Squadron. I could still be wrong.