Premier Fighter Squadron

[EARTHLING]

56 Squadron appears to have been the premier squadron in 1917 but its record in 1918 shows some deterioration. 74 Squadron appears to have occupied the no. 1 post and according to Ira Jones had eclipsed 56's record in shooting down 50, 100, and 200 hostile machines.
What does the Forum think? Are there any other contenders?
VBR
Peter S

[Rick]

Peter S,

* *I assume we are limiting the discussion to RFC/RAF squadrons, and you do not wish to have Jagdstaffel 11 enter the picture. * * *;D * R.

You'd be disappointed if the Aussies didn't chime in at this point, wouldn't you? *;D

I'd like to nominate 4 Sqn Australian Flying Corps as one of the best rotary engined scout squadrons on the British and Commonwealth side in 1918. *They were certainly recognised at the time as being one of the most skilled and aggressive scout squadrons on the front.

In 11 months on the front (they reached France around Christmas 1917) they claimed; 128 Aircraft Destroyed, 32 Balloons Destroyed, 63 Aircraft OOC and 8 Driven Down. *BTW a lower than usual ratio of Destroyed/OOC. Of these about 200 were claimed by Camels and about 35 by Snipes.

They flew 8987 hours; fired 378,945 rounds in action; dropped over 57 tons of bombs and crossed the lines 5549 times. They received 3 DSOs, 3 MCs, 9 DFCs, 3 bars to the DFC and 1 Meritorious Service Medal.

In balance they lost 16 pilots killed in combat, 9 killed in accidents, 1 MIA, 14 wounded, 14 PoW and 5 injured in accidents.

(All stats from Australian Airmen - E J Richards)


A pretty impressive record all round.

[EARTHLING]

Gordon

You are right it is a pretty impressive record but not as good as 74 in the sense that they didn't start until April 1918 and still managed more victories.
The 4th probably had much more in the way of ground attacking to do, whereas with the SE5 it occupied the relative safety of the higher ground!!
Comparisons are odious and we shouldn't be doing this anyway.
My other point really is that 56 was a fairly run of the mill squadron by late 1918 and living on its past reputation. That should provoke an outcry.
Regards
Peter S

Gordon,

>I'd like to nominate 4 Sqn Australian Flying
>Corps as one of the best rotary engined scout
>squadrons


I would like to nominate 1 Squadron Australian Flying Corps as well. Not only did they supply dominant air superiority in Palestine but did all the other tasks of an Army squadron as well.

As to personnel they included in their ranks great combat airmen, combat leaders and post-war civic airman as Ross Smith, Hudson Fysh, Ginty McGuiness, Pard Mustar', Ron Adair, Lawrence Wackett, Richard Williams, George Mills, Peter Drummond, Frank McNamara, Adrian 'King' Cole, Frank Lukis and Arthur 'Spud' Murphy. A remarkable bunch of men, both in WWI and after in the RAAF or in civilians airlines.

The squadron had the highest decorated aircraft of the British and Commonwealth forces in B1229, that aircraft collecting seventeen'gongs'.

The squadron also included seven Knighthoods, one VC, one DSO, two OBE's, eighteen MC's, two MM's, twenty DFC's, twelve MSM's, six foreign orders and fifty mentions in dispatches.

A remarkable squadron.


cam

[JoaoMVM]

In terms of records, RAF fighter squadrons in 1918 failry equal eachother although 74th, 24th and 203rd take a slight lead. 56th and 84th were also great squadrons.

But 203 really seems the best. Aces like Collishaw, Beamish, Little, Whealy and others make a really incredible team.

On the Geramn side, besides the obvious Richthofen Circus, JG3 of Loerzer was a formidable group becoming the premier Circus late in the war, and as for Jastas , nº 5(of Schmidt) and nº15(of Veltjens) seem very strong.

Joao

[Rick]

Bill Bailey wishes to offer 20 Sqn. RFC/RAF. Although a two-seater unit, he believes it was the highest scoring of all the RFC/RAF Squadrons. R.

Many years ago when the RB2 squadrons were getting their ratings checked I made up a list of the British Fighter squadrons and divided up their victories by months at the front, and other statistics such as ace contribution etc. They give a good impression for overall comparison.

The top five squadrons for Victories per month

25 : 74 Sqn (SE5a)
24.5 : 88 Sqn (F2b)
21.53 : 84 Sqn (SE5a)
20 : 4 Sqn AFC (Camel/Snipe)
19.16 : 10 RNAS/210 RAF (Triplane/Camel)

I think I worked out the average was about 12 victories per month for the British and Commonwealth Squadrons. I will post the whole list if there is interest.

The top squadrons that had the aces contributing the greatest amount to the total number of victories.

100% 24 Sqn RAF
100% 43 Sqn RAF
100% 3 RNAS/203 RAF
100% 8 RNAS/208 RAF
100% 9 RNAS/209 RAF
100% 13 RNAS/213 RAF
96.57% 1 Sqn RAF
93.49% 84 Sqn RAF
93.33 74 Sqn RAF
92.93% 46 Sqn RAF
91.01% 10 RNAS/210 RAF

Incidentally 4 Sqn AFC is 67.27% and 88 Sqn RAF 77.55%. The squadrons with the aces contributing the least.

37.14% 6 RNAS/206 RAF
38.33% 80 Sqn RAF
48.14% 54 Sqn RAF
49.15% 111 Sqn RAF
55% 11 Sqn RAF

The top five squadrons where aces who scored more than 20 contributed as a percentage. This is to determine top heavy squadrons reliant on individuals for scoring rather than squadron performance.

42.62% 43 Sqn RAF
42.22% 74 Sqn RAF
42.01% 56 Sqn RAF
41.61% 8 RNAS / 208 RAF
40.76% 46 Sqn RAF

That was done to work out where a few aces were skewing a squadrons score, to discover all round squadrons that may have better effectiveness and arent reliant on a couple of aces being present.


cam

[jonathon]

It seems to me everyone is trying to outdo each other,no-one seems to know anything about no 32 Squadron,all I have is my fathers log book showing repeated sorties into France,then they were involved in close strafing of the German lines,nothing romantic about that except they had very high casualties.The records for that squadron are very elusive,any help from anyone ?
Jonathon

[Barrett]

It's not at all unusual to find "ace heavy" squadrons doing well; a similar situation existed in F-86 units in Korea. Part of the reason is that leaders get to be shooters and may or may not share the wealth. However, IMO a truly professional organization would not consciously develop a policy of making the select few the inevitable shooters. Those guys will be killed, captured, wounded, or rotate out, leaving an unnecessary shortage of experienced pilots. You want some depth in the lineup, same as any other team!