Help Identifying Downed Airplane

stephen · 24 April 2007, 07:54 AM

This is a long shot, but...

I have a description of a single seat airplane coming down between the lines near Grandpre in the last week of Sept or first week of Oct 1918. The machine was described as having American roundels. The pilot, with no helmet or gloves, was said to have flipped his plane in the barbed wire and survived the crash only to be shot by Germans during his dash for Allied lines.

This is sketchy at best but I thought I'd throw it out here... I'm having a hard time finding any good candidates as to who the pilot might have been.

Hey, Mike O'Neal... does this sound like any of your Jersey boys?

ONEALM · 24 April 2007, 11:11 AM

Stephen -

I don't think so, but let me check the losses foe that time. The only one that comes to mind immediately is Alan Nutt (94 Aero), but I know he was dead when he hit the ground on 26 September and they found him in his SPAD so he obviously wasn't running at the time....

I'm 5 bios from the finish line so the appendices are next in line which will include a comprehensive losses list.....

keep at it,
Mike

Graeme · 24 April 2007, 03:50 PM

Stephen

From

The Sky Their Battlefield:

26 September 1918:

1st Lt A C Kimber, 22nd Pursuit Sqn, Kia
1st Lt J Roth, 49th Pursuit Sqn, Kia
1st Lt A Nutt, 94th Pursuit Sqn, Kia
1st Lt H E Petre, 139th Pursuit Sqn, Kia
1st Lt H R Summer, 139th Pursuit Sqn, Kia
1st Lt H A Garvie, 139th Pursuit Sqn, Kia

29 September 1918:

1st Lt T A Gabel, 49th Pursuit Sqn, Kia
1st Lt R H Fuller, 93rd Pursuit Sqn, Kia

1 October 1918:

1st Lt C A Brodie, 13th Pursuit sqn, Kia
1st Lt G D Stivers, 13th Pursuit sqn, Kia

4 October 1918:

1st Lt H G Armstrong, 13th Pursuit Sqn, Kia
1st Lt J F Merrill, 28th Pursuit Sqn, Kia
1st Lt C A Kinney, 49th Pursuit Sqn, Kia

5 October 1918:

1st Lt H B Hudson, 22nd Pursuit Sqn, Kia

7 October 1918:

2nd Lt W MacFadden (or McFadden?), 103rd Pursuit Sqn, Kia

Unfortunately, I don't which, if any, of these losses occurred in the vicinity of Grandpre.

Graeme

stephen · 30 April 2007, 09:59 AM

Thanks, that's still a big help. I wondered about Alan Nutt, too, but as Mike said he was dead when he hit the ground. I hear that the cockpit was a mess of blood when they found him, so that rules him out.

ONEALM · 30 April 2007, 10:21 AM

Stephen -

Merrill (28 Aero) was also a NJ boy. Reportedly shot down near Montfaucon, two days later his body was reported found near Natillois.

There's not word about whether or not he was found in his airplane and they do not say "found him and his airplane...." only that they located his body.

Without looking at the map I can't say if this is your boy or not, but if he turns out to be your man, I'd be very interested in that.

If you'll be at the OtF gig coming up, track down Bob Kasprzak (or tage along and I will !) - he's Mrs 28th Aero and while he hasn't given me the indication he's discovered anything this unusual about Merrill, you never know....

stephen · 1 May 2007, 05:33 AM

That's a good idea. I'll be in DC and I've been wanting to meet Bob anyway since he's in charge of the Ohio OTF gang which is my general area. And of course I'll be glad to pass along anything related to NJ.

Volker_Nemsch · 4 May 2007, 10:27 AM

Hello!

Graeme mentioned the following pilot:

1st Lt J F Merrill, 28th Pursuit Sqn, Kia on 04.10.1918

Due to the offered locations (Grandpré and Nantillois) this does not fit together.

Grandpré is approx. 15 km west of Romagne-sous-Montfaucon (the big cemetery of American soldiers of WW1) while Nantillois is approx. 6 km southeast of Romagne-sous-Montfaucon.

Montfaucond'Argonne is approx. 8 km south-southeast of Romagne-sous-Montfaucon and 3 km south of Nantillois. The distance is to big for a simple mistake ...

I hope this helps a bit ...

Volker_Nemsch · 4 May 2007, 11:27 AM

Hello (again)!

I jst checked Graeme's list against "The Jasta War Chronology" and again against the distances given by "Google Earth". This is the result:

26 September 1918:
1st Lt A C Kimber, 22nd Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- probably ground fire?
1st Lt J Roth, 49th Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- Etain, (55 km east of Grandpré) by Vfw Franke
1st Lt A Nutt, 94th Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- Gercourt, (22 km east of Grandpré) by Lt. Büchner, 35. victory
1st Lt H E Petre, 139th Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- SW of Etain, (55 km east of Grandpré) by Lt. Schäfer, 9. victory
1st Lt H R Summer, 139th Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- near Etain, (55 km east of Grandpré) by Lt. V. Hantelmann, 17. victory
1st Lt H A Garvie, 139th Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- POW, Bertincourt, (far away, north of Paris, flandres area) by Vfw Haussmann, 15. victory

29 September 1918:
1st Lt T A Gabel, 49th Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- N of Jouy(-en-Argonne?), (35 km SE of Grandpré) by OfStv Hünninghaus, 4. victory
1st Lt R H Fuller, 93rd Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- probably ground fire?

1 October 1918:
1st Lt C A Brodie, 13th Pursuit sqn, Kia --- no location given, Lt. Müller, 13. victory
1st Lt G D Stivers, 13th Pursuit sqn, Kia --- no location given, Lt. Künster, 2. victory

4 October 1918:
1st Lt H G Armstrong, 13th Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- W of Villers-devant-Dun (18 km (eastnortheast of Grandpré), Lt. Becker,20. victory
1st Lt J F Merrill, 28th Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- Meuse valley (min. 23 km east of Grandpré) (55 km east of Grandpré (55 km east of Grandpré by Vfw Schmückle, 6. victory
1st Lt C A Kinney, 49th Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- NE of Brieulles by Lt. Veltjens, 34. victory

5 October 1918:
1st Lt H B Hudson, 22nd Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- Montfaucon by Vfw Weischer, 4. victory

7 October 1918:
2nd Lt W MacFadden (or McFadden?), 103rd Pursuit Sqn, Kia --- probably ground fire?

The underlined names are probable hits. They may have been shot down near Grandpré because they were not claimed by a German pilot and so became victims of ground fire (frontline as well as AA-batteries in the 'Hinterland'). And in these cases there is no location of the crash given and so Grandpré is a possible place where the machines crashed.

Just an attempt ...