Swiss Airforce during WWI

[leo]

During WWII the Swiss Airforce interned both Allied and Axis aircraft. In some case after air battles. Does anyone know if this also might have happened during WWI?

[Barrett]

Can't say about WW I, but in WW II the Swiss AF shot down more German planes than Allies by a wide margin. I have details here somewhere.

[Barrett]

Aha! Here 'tis:
The Swiss AF shot down 11 German and 5 US aircraft in WW II, according to an internet contact in Switzerland. Seven of the total (all German, obviously) occurred in 1940. The US types were B-17s, 24s, and a P-47. These figures are exclusive of the many a/c from both sides that landed there
Sorta makes you wonder about Switzerland's alleged subservience to Germany...
Back to WW I:
I don't know about the situation during the war, but the SAF got Nieuport 28s afterward, undoubtedly among other types. At least a few Swiss flew with France in 1916-18.

Just finished reading 'Chased by the Sun' by Hank Nelson. It's about Australian aircrew in Bomber Command in WW2.
In the book a pilot relates that when his plane flew over Swiss territory the flak only started after they had left the area.

[leo]

" A few Swiss flew with France"
About 1/3 of Switzerland is French speaking.

I do not know if any Swiss flew with Germany, but there were a number who fought in the German services in both WWI and WWII.

My cousin tokd me that during WWII, there were a lot of US bombers interned in Switzerland. How many that was, I do not remember.

[JohnMacG]

The Swiss did intern a/c from both sides during WWI, the S-Schuckert DIII is probably the best-known single a/c, but there was a Pfalz DIII as well. Oddly enough, there's been a fair amount published about what the Swiss interned in WW2 but I can't remember anything similar for WWI.
If you want to know what the Swiss flew between '14-'18 the magazine 'Insignia' (from the guy who does Blue Rider decals) covered this in issue #14, Spring/Summer 2000

Dear Leo,

*This should be a delight for us to look-up and research; it's from Jane's FIGHTING AIRCRAFT OF WORLD WAR 1 (page 223):

*"Among the Swiss aviator serving with the French Aviation Militaire, Blancpain fell on the field of honour.

*"To his name should be added that of Sergeant Théophile Ingold, of Escadrille N.23, who died of injuries received during a reconnaissance. He was recipient of a citation à l'ordre de l'armée and was proposed for the Médaille militaire; he was a cousin of Karl Ingold, serving with the German Flying Corps."

*Moving on to WW2, one might find it ironic that those Swiss victories were accomplished flying Me-109's! It seems that the first radar equipped Me-110 landed accidentially in Switzerland, the crew thinking that the location was Stuttgart. (Obviously, that must have been a VERY early radar set!) The Germans offered the Swiss 12 109's, in exchange for the 110 and their silence concerning the new technology. (Wouldn't want THAT radar to fall into the wrong hands, now would we?) It seems then that the 110 caught fire and was destroyed; but the Germans still delivered the 109's when they were satisfied that it was an accident. A few weeks later, those same 109's, now Swiss, downed a few Germans that violated Swiss airspace and refused to land...

*Also from the dustbin of history: did anyone ever hear about the B-17's that force-landed in Sweden? There were a number of them; in fact, the Swedes actually rebuilt some of them after the war as AIRLINERS! (Sounds just like something those industrious Swiss would do, but I swear, it was them Swedes!)

*All the best to you and La Mére de la Russie...

Captain Lewis

[stephen]

Yup. The Swiss, taking self interest to new heights, swiped both aircraft and pilots from both sides. They ended up with a nice array of aircraft, including an Albatros and a Fokker DVII that they somehow finangled after the war. Of course, after the war just about everyone except Germany had DVII's.

Switzerland - aircraft interned in, Aeroplane Monthly, January-February-March 1993; Aeroplane Monthly, May-June-July 1993; Aeroplane Monthly, August 1990; Aeroplane Monthly, April 1997 (German aircraft); Flypast, August 1990 (B-17)

[Frank_Olynyk]

The Swiss bought some Bf-109Ds and E-3s from Germany in 1939 I believe. During the French campaign of May-June 1940 these were credited with shooting down eight German aircraft (4 He-111 and 4 Bf-110), and damaging a Do-17. The Germans started by using Swiss air space to avoid French fighters. The Swiss reaction caused them to attempt to set up an ambush, which did not turn out to their advantage. Göring then threatened to withhold parts for the Bf-109s if the Swiss didn't stop attacking German aircraft in Swiss air space, and the Swiss sort of gave in when the French campaign ended.
On the night of April 27/28, 1944 (Ober?)Leutnant Wilhelm Johnen claimed a Lancaster, but his aircraft (Bf-110G-4 Werknummer 740055 C9+EN) was damaged in a second engagement, and he force landed in Switzerland. The aircraft was examined by the Swiss, but was destroyed by German request in exchange for 12 (I think) Bf-109Gs. These aircraft were never used in combat, because the engines were in really bad condition. After the war the Swiss sued the Germans over the engines, and won. Swiss claims after the French campaign are in 1944 and 1945, some German, some American. Most of these seem to have been claimed by the D 3801, an export version of the MS 407. Among the claims are 2 B-17s and 2 B-24s, all of which seem to have been abandoned by their crews before the combats; the remaining claims are for a German operated Fiat RS 14, a Do-215, a Ju-52, and a P-47D-22.

The Swiss did not "swipe" aircraft. Interned aircraft are still owned by their original operator; they are just in their possession. After the war most aircraft were destroyed, but some were bought by the Swiss (and the Swedes as well).

Johnen died Feb 7, 2002.

Frank.