Cross and Cockade/ Over the Front

[Mark_Miller]

Aviatik,

* *Being ax ex Aerospace Engineer, I tend to agree with you. *However, for proposals, where the page count is strictly limited, then I must take exception. * Although, I suspect, that many of those went unread also!! * * R.

well this sounds familiar.
I've worked in an in-house pubs department for:
Goodrich/Raytheon/Hughes Aerospace/Perkin-Elmer for 20 yrs now. I've worked on all kinds of props, some for NASA, I think we even worked with Boeing once or twice.

And it's always the same story - Cram as much as you can and white space be damned. Thank God the RFPs usualy have page limits AND minimum font size requirements.
But if they find a loophole your in for trouble.
A couple times the RFP forgot to spec minimum font sizes for the illustrations - so the engineers decided to jam as much data as they could into the figures.
what a nightmare :

Even so - I still like working with engineers *
Mark

[Rick]

Mark,

* *Some of us are OK. *I'm not saying that I am, only some of us!! * * *R.

[Aviatik]

John G,

Drat, in retrospect I was worried after I posted the message that it might be misconstrued as hostile. My humble apologies if that is how you saw my comments. I guess a smiley face can only go so far. The accountant remark wasn't meant to be insulting. Guess it lost something there, smiley face or not.

Like you, I am a hardworking chap who is concerned with doing the best work for his pay. My remarks were to answer your questions as to the whys and wherefores AND give some more information about other things that are important to us here and what we are working to achieve. My comments are to show how we are advancing in the publication and what our mindset is when it comes to content and presentation. The comments about design problems were related to OTF only and not to C & C in any way. My comments focus on our efforts to improve and make a publication that is valued highly. Your comments were very important and I take them very seriously. They cannot be valued too highly. Thank you.

Another thing to be considered is readership. The age cross section for our respective publications is older, many of the readers being in their 50's to 70's or older. There is a problem that many of our older readers have passed on in the last decade and will continue to do so. Gaining younger readers is something that is of paramount importance for survival of our respective publications. With the advances in publishing technology and the proliferation of all types of publications as a result, you now have very sophisticated audiences in the younger age brackets. Presentation becomes more of an issue when you are looking to gain younger readers who read more commercial looking publications. Design must change to reflect that from time to time. Look at the first Cross & Cockade issues of the early 1960s. Content was good, but presentation reflected the times and the technology. Lonnie Raidor and George Cooke handtyped every page in the early days and for some years afterwards. (I'm glad I don't have to do that anymore!)

As far as the bios go, my feeling is that it isn't like by yanking them you are going to gain a whole page. If it was a word processing app, sure you gain space, but, in the layout it isn't going to gain much at all. It isn't a cummulative problem. It is a spacial problem. Maybe an add would fit in that space but not much else! There are a few occasions when a bio wasn't submitted and so an article went out without it. But, I usually hear about it later when that happens. Also, when an article is a translation of a piece with an author long since dead, we don't publish bios on them. Or if an author submitted more than one article we certainly aren't going to put that at the end of every one of them.

I have shelves full of Cross & Cockade International, which in my view is essential reading for anyone interested in WWI Aviation History. Shouldn't be without it. And, I'll also be taking a look at what our friends in the southern hemisphere are doing. Their publication sounds a treat as well.

With best regards and intentions,

Aviatik

[john_g]

Aviatik

Thanks for you apologie, but it really was not warrented, I did not feel that you being hostile, but at the same time I felt that things might be warming up a little as I got the impression that my comments were un welcome critisism. Also I did not take any of your comments as a slight on C&CI.

Next week I will turn the dreaded 50, yes I will become a wrinkly - it's all down hill from now on! I do have to wear glasses and I am undoubtedly a hazard on the road!!

I agree gaining members is of paramount importance if any of the journals is to survive and prosper, and you are all to be congratulated on your efforts.

Bio, well as said, that is a house editorial issue, I do not agree with you, that is my position. you say that yanking them you are not going to gain much, well afraid I would not agree, it's a cumulative thing (as far as I am concerned ) over a year etc.

Hope we have cleared the air, so to speak, I still enjoy the Journals I receive. Happy easter to all our readers.

John

[Aviatik]

John G,

Thanks for the healthy exchange. I appreciate it. It helps me with my work.

I hope your Easter is also very enjoyable... Oh, and Happy 50th Birthday!

Aviatik

[Droops]

Just to add my two cents, I subscribed to OTF last year for the first time. When the renewal came, I took advantage of the offer and also signed up for C&C.

I just received my first issue of C&C this year. Fun stuff, but as I was reading, I found that I sometimes lost my place and had to re-read certain sentences. I did this a few times when I suddenly remembered this conversation!

I'm 39, and though my eyes are fading they're still good close up for reading and such. I just thought it was interesting that I could validate, with experience, the scenario outlined here.

VBR,

John

[errolmartyn]

[QUOTE]

You might find helful the 'Audio [C&C] Journals for visually impaired members' service advertised in the bottom left hand corner of page 2 of the first C&C issue for 2002. 'Selected books also available' free of charge to members.

Errol

[Amy]

FWIW, I like the little added bios of article authors. I like knowing the author's background. I suppose it's a neccessary evil to keep adding the author bio even though he/she has written articles previously for the benefit of the new reader. Everyone has to start somewhere.


There was an article a few years ago in OTF titled "Richthofen the Archetypal Hero" (or something like that). I was familiar with the individual words in the article, but put together they made no sense. Can anyone interpret?

[leo]

I just received my copy of C&C yesterday. I love the magazine, but there sure are differences in style between Yanks and Brits.

[MilesC]

I would LOVE to see a set of CDs of back issues for C&CI and OTF (as well as CJAHS). This I would consider shelling out $$ for as I don't have a large journal collection, and there are darned few libraries that collect this material. If this happens, please let us know.