He was a real Hun-Getter!

[cspellman]

Well, finally reading 'Flying Fury' and its clear McCudden was definately one of these Hun-getter types. *Strange thing is that at times he seems compassionate about the killing of his enemies and other times he seems to rejoice in stalking them like wild game. *I know MVR was considered rather cold-blooded but McCudden doesn't seem far removed. *Certain instances he mentions the ghastly sight of seeing an observer fall from a stricken two-seater and at other times he talks about seeing the dead occupants and later going back to the aerodrome to celebrate the kills. *Such is war I guess. *I just wonder how many of these pilots struggled with the sight of their enemies falling to their doom. *There is an obvious them or us mentality that must be taken in times of war and perhaps that is what McCudden's view was.

[Ginger.]

Chris,
is it in 'Flying Fury' where all Mac's mates gather round to rejoice at the blood splattered on the cowling from one of his victims?

Take any man out of ordered society . Tell them that they must kill . Reward them for killing , and you will have so many different reactions at different times . Is it any wonder that many can never go back to their lives that they left , or will never be the same .
I think it's put perfectly in Sassoons poem " Decorated ".
The real crime is that 's exactly what was expected of them , to go back to normal life and not show any symptoms of what they had been through .... A land fit for hero's indeed .
Phil.

[EdStevens]

Add to the mix that you also have to deal with the fact that the other fellow is trying to kill you in the same way. How do you rationalize their behaviour as it relates to your own, equivalent actions? Again, the result is as variable as human nature. To many, the enemy becomes a respected opponent on a par with your own side, sharing the "game" you both play. For others it's easier to ignore the human side and simply shoot down enemy aeroplanes, conveniently forgetting as much as possible that there are humans inside. And for some, especially those who had lost friends or suffered because of the war, it was easiest to use hate as the motivating factor.

[Tailspin]

Even the name "Hun," like Bosche, Kraut, Square Head and even Jerry, had a dehumanizing effect to it. You didn't kill a man, you killed a Hun. The propaganda machinery convinced you that the Huns were little more than savage beasts who raped and pillaged any territory they conquered. You fought to free those places and to prevent the Hun from spreading his misery.

BTW, this propaganda was exposed as bull*#&@ after the war. An unfortunate byproduct was that the reports of Nazi excesses 25 years later were taken with a grain of salt. (In a similar way, who's going to believe the US and UK when we say that the NEXT despot has weapons of mass destruction? But I'm wandering off topic here).

[Barrett]

I recommend Lt. col. Dave Grossman's study, "On Killing." It's gained wide readership in military and law enforcement circles, and he's a popular speaker. IMO he places too much trust in SLA Marshall's questionable Shooter/Nonshooter figures and, being a gravel-cruncher, he doesn't really have a handle on aviation. But his historical comparisons are fascinating and his take on contemporary "active shooter" incidents make a lot of sense.

[cspellman]

I don't think he gloated about the blood on his own machine but a fellow squadron mate thought he had blood on his wings and seemed rather elated about it and called all the pilots out to have a look only to find out that it was some sort of rust-preventative chemical on the aircraft!!

Chris,
is it in 'Flying Fury' where all Mac's mates gather round to rejoice at the blood splattered on the cowling from one of his victims?

[cspellman]

Yeah, the defaming of the enemy must be as old as warfare itself. This makes me wonder about what the Germans called the English pilots. Was there a reference for an aggressive German pilot who shot down lots of English or French planes? Frog-getter? :P

Even the name "Hun," *like Bosche, Kraut, Square Head and even Jerry, had a dehumanizing effect to it. *You didn't kill a man, you killed a Hun. *The propaganda machinery convinced you that the Huns were little more than savage beasts who raped and pillaged any territory they conquered. *You fought to free those places and to prevent the Hun from spreading his misery. *

BTW, this propaganda was exposed as bull*#&@ after the war. *An unfortunate byproduct was that the reports of Nazi excesses 25 years later were taken with a grain of salt. *(In a similar way, who's going to believe the US and UK when we say that the NEXT despot has weapons of mass destruction? *But I'm wandering off topic here).

[cspellman]

I'm glad you brought this up. In Yeate's classic novel, Winged Victory the character Tom Cundall dwells on this phenom often. It brings about the grander issues on human nature and killing. In the book, Cundall got no satisfaction killing Germans and as the war dragged on he despised the very thought of shooting down airplanes. He reminds us often how as a plane went down there was a human inside and terms like "Poor Devil" are used. Cundall is a man trapped within a war he wants none of and kills merely to survive and to fulfill a duty. He does mention that there are certain fellows that seem to thrive on the killing trade and hence the term "Hun-getter" is used for those types.

Add to the mix that you also have to deal with the fact that the other fellow is trying to kill you in the same way. How do you rationalize their behaviour as it relates to your own, equivalent actions? Again, the result is as variable as human nature. To many, the enemy becomes a respected opponent on a par with your own side, sharing the "game" you both play. For others it's easier to ignore the human side and simply shoot down enemy aeroplanes, conveniently forgetting as much as possible that there are humans inside. And for some, especially those who had lost friends or suffered because of the war, it was easiest to use hate as the motivating factor.

[Ginger.]

Must have got my wires crossed. I remember the incident with the anti rust paste. The other one was the pilot noticed blood on his windscreen and went to wipe what he thought was a nosebleed. Finding no blood on his face he realised the blood was on the other side of the windscreen and was from his victim. When he landed him and his mates found blood spattered on the cowling?
Could have sworn this was in Mac's book, then again maybe it was a story about Albert Ball. He usualy got a lot closer than most.