Richthofen a Cold blooded Killer??

[jamoz]

So was he a cold blooded killer like some people say? What is the truth?

[reservepilot]

Jamoz,

I put my response to your question/statement on the other thread, but I will post it here for discusion since it is more appropriately "on topic" here.

A fighter pilot, to be good, is a "cold killer". Pure and simple. There can be no argument. For a good fighterpilot to be anything else can cost him his life. Perhaps, when von Richthofen began to feel the pressures of war, brought on by his head injury and dissolusionment at the prospect of a German loss, (and perhaps compasion), he was killed. Whether you beleive the Aussis shot him down from the ground or Brown tagged him from the air, odds are his mind was not fully committed, or in the game, at the time of his demise. No one knew but him. However, his letters to his parents are probably the best indicator of his state of mind. I have seen nothing to make me change my opinion as to their authenticity, but I may be incorrect.

George

[Dan_San_Abbott]

Jamoz:
In aerial combat, there is no second place!
Blue skies,
Dan-San

[FliegerJG1]

Uh oh....here we go again.....I say this because questions about this person become so controversial and attract all kinds of flak. I want to give you as honest an answer as possible.

Actually whether or not MvR was cold blooded will depend on how you want to interpret and weight the documentation. Some people take quotes that come out of his memoirs. These were written in May-June 1917 and were highly censored as published--both MvR later on and his family denied that these reflected his true character and experience. Early on he was idealistic and eager to get into the fight as were many patriotic men on both sides of the conflict. He wasn't a fighter pilot for long before he saw that Germany wasn't going to win the war and things were quite serious. Therefore, early comments may sound cold blooded.

Everyone seems to have zeroed in on the cold blooded aspect...perhaps because he is credited as the top ace of the war...but as I read other ace memoirs, their thoughts are very much the same as his. Those who knew Richthofen personally record his charming friendly disposition. His family remembers him as full of life and energy. He also had the unpleasant job of leading the air war for Germany and the very nature of this is going to make ones actions apparently harsh. He led by example, personally training pilots, and wasn't going to get results by being soft or "nice."

I feel that if one were to take MvR and place the person in an RFC uniform and a Sopwith Pup, the talk of being cold blooded might disappear.

Just my 2 cents here...hope this may prove helpful....

FliegerJG1

[LedZepplane]

Originally Posted by jamoz

So was he a cold blooded killer like some people say? What is the truth?

When you’re trained either as a solder in the trenches or a fighter pilot your soul purpose is to kill as many of the enemy as you can. I have never seen combat and hope that I never do, but if it came to preserve my life on the battlefield I guess I could become a “trained killer” But that still doesn’t mean that I wouldn’t have a sense of moral countenance about myself. The same with von Richthofen, and I don’t understand why people ask the question if Richthofen was a “cold blooded killer”? You can’t talk ethics and morals over with your appoint regarding the political issues of war and why we’re here slaughtering one another….that’s a subject for cold blooded politicians to discus. After all, it’s their alliances and political policies that are responsible for millions of young men being behind the guns of war. Richthofen was a skilled soldier, a man of valor.

Danny

[margaret smith]

Richthofen was a great guy, just like a lot of other aces in the war. But when you are in the skies with bullets whizzing all around you it's kill or be killed and that's the hard cold facts.

[reservepilot]

Gentlemen and Madam:

I do not disagree with any of your comments. This question came about because I made the comment on another thread that MvR, from his own letters and memoirs was a despondent cold killer. I stated that I hoped the new MvR movie would present this side of his personality in the cockpit.

I have stated, and I stand by it, that to be a good fighter pilot you have to have this attitude in order to survive. Whomever is to blame for creating the venue in which a fighter pilot plys his trade is another matter. Simply stated, and I do not want to beat this dead horse anymore, to survive a fighter pilot must have killer instinct, superior training, a lot of luck or providence, if you will.

George

[R Pope]

The man had a dog that loved him. How cold could he be?

[Pips]

According to contemporary accounts one of the nicest, warmest human beings ever encountered was John Cunningham, the outstanding pioneer British night fighter ace of WWII with 20 odd victories. Yet he showed no mercy to any of his victims. Indeed night fighting is even more a case of cold blooded murder than day fighting.

Cecil Lewis probably said it best when he stated:
" In all air fighting (and indeed in every branch of aerial warfare) there is an essential in which it differs from war on the ground: it's absolute cold-bloodedness. You could not lose your temper with an aeroplane. You cannot 'see red'. You certainly cannot resort to 'Dutch' courage. Any of these may fog your judgement - and that spells death. Like duelling, air fighting required a set steely courage, drained of all emotion, fined down to a tense and deadly effort of will. The Angel of Death is less callous, aloof, and implacable than a fighting pilot when he dives.

Given that Lewis served with such notable aces as Ball, McCudden, Rhys-Davies and others, and was an ace himself, the above is a very illuminating comment on the general state of mind to air fighting.

[VtwinVince]

What, Ginger hasn't jumped all over this one yet? This is more of the usual allied nonsensical stereotyping. The allied aces were all jovial, good-natured gentlemen whilst the Germans were rabid, cold-blooded, raping-and-pillaging murderers. And of course history is always completely black and white