Voss Ran out of Bullets

[Taz]

ZAK- You obvously have never had anybody shoot at you. I gives you a whole new outlook on life. Too many movies make you think it is possible to shoot the gun out of the bad guy's hand or hand him back his sword after he was disarmed. Baloney. Voss was coming down very close to the lines, regardless of how low he was and what direction he was pointing, and was only seconds from escape if he restarted his engine and zoomed off, a common WW-I ploy. Applying your 21st Century, touchy-feely morality by disparaging someone from another era who had been involved in a war for three years does not reflect positively on you.

Taz
Terry Phillips

Never a question mark behind the behavior of an Allied, even 90 years later.

"Zur Landung gezwungen" (forced to land) was tried a lot by German pilots with success, even if the opponent had shot at them before. It is not from the movies, it is from their reports.

ZAK

[Ginger.]

[Taz]

ZAK- Sure, "forced to land" worked fine when the enemy was several or dozens of kilometers behind the lines and had no chance of escaping.

You are trying to bring a national us vs them mentality into the Forum and hinting prejudice based on nationality which does not normally exist. (Except for Ginger, of course, but we all know he is playing a part). That is an undertone we can do without.

I am probably the biggest Voss fan anywhere, but slamming Rhys Davids does nothing to improve Voss' image. Get a grip.

Taz
Terry Phillips

[NeilE]

Essentially these airmen were involved in direct combat. The idea was to kill, maim, or capture the enemy if he surrendered in such situations. Rhys-Davids was doing what he was ordered to do. It is likely that Voss would have done the same thing in the same situation.

One question comes to mind in this exchange that always puzzles me. We often see the deaths of Allied aces just as they were, whilst there are often seen to be some sinister motive behind the deaths of famous German aces. Why is this?

Regards

Neil

[Barrett]

"Why is this?"

I suspect Archie Whitehouse's influence over 30-odd years!

[tcrean7828]

Voss knew all about trying to kill in cold blood.

All the alternate scenario's relating to Voss' death and the "fairness" of it, have one thing in common: They're all based on speculation and conjecture.

What is'nt in doubt though, is the fact that he strafed defenceless opponents on at least two occasions (his victory No.s; 19 and 33), after he'd brought them down.

Not quite the noble warrior some would have us believe him to have been.

Regards.

Bucky.
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Here's a reply to Southside Bucky:

Voss was a killer as that is what his job required, but he was also companionate as well to his fallen enemies:
I.e., On 21 Dec 1916 flying near Miraumount, his Albatros swooped down on a slow moving B.E.2d that was spotting for British artillery and shot it down. The Observer was dead, but the pilot, Lieutenant Harold Davis was taken prisoner. Voss visited Davis in the hospital and once again at the POW camp at Krefeld , where the German gave him his visiting card. ‘Aviation History July 2003 by O’Brien Browne – pg32.
• In Norman Franks and Hal Giblin's book ‘Under the Guns of the German Aces: Immelmann, Voss, Goring, Lothar Von Richthofen : The Complete Record of Their Victories and Victims’ it revealed that Werner Voss shot down Lt. Peter Daly's DH2 of No. 29 Squadron on 1 February 1917 for his 4th victory and Daly came down with a shoulder wound behind the German lines and was taken as a POW. Days later, Voss visited Daly in the hospital and gave him a box of cigars, and enquired if he was being looked after properly. "Before leaving, Voss gave Daly his visiting card and a signed photograph - rather an extravagant gesture for a scout pilot with only four victories." Thus, Voss- like most pilots on both sides - could show friendship and mercy to a downed enemy airman, after the heat of battle was over.

I am slowly learning from the masters - Taz, Alex, etc, point your references out.

[tcrean7828]

From Ginger,
tcrean7828, likewise about making your acquaintance.
A thread about the Hun Lover's bestest loved dynamic dwarf always gets me in the end.... try as I might to be a better person.
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If history serves me right Ginger – I believe that Werner Voss was a lot taller than MvR and his brother Lother – Which is why I don't seem the understand the dwarf you keep referring too. It must be an inside joke that this yank is missing.

blush:

Originally Posted by Taz

Think about Guynemer ... letting Udet go after Udet's guns jammed. That gesture ... probably cost another 50 dead French, British, and American airmen.

Good to know that Rhys-Davids was killed, saved probably the live of 50 German airmen.

ZAK

[Ross_Moorhouse]

Lets keep this clean people. No low blows please or I will lock this thead down.