Goering's Jewish Wingman?

Frank_Olynyk · 2 May 2007, 03:53 PM

Lawrence,

Many thanks for the information. Do you know where the original is located, and how I might go about getting a copy? And do you (or anyone else) know the actual date of his death? All I have found is 1949, with the possibility of May. But no exact date.

Frank.

Lawrence Milner · 3 May 2007, 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank_Olynyk

Lawrence,

Many thanks for the information. Do you know where the original is located, and how I might go about getting a copy? And do you (or anyone else) know the actual date of his death? All I have found is 1949, with the possibility of May. But no exact date.

Frank.

Frank - According to the newspaper obitury that I have he was killed on the 24th May, 1949. The actual records of the CAA appear to have been lost but the File No. is 363. Willy was in his aircraft Tiger Moth ZS BFK on the ground on a private air strip and his friend George Scheibe landed his Piper Cub ZS BVC on top of him, causing his death. Willy had taught George to fly. I have no idea where the original autobiography is, but I get the impression that a number of copies must be in circulation as I see frequent quotes from it from members of this forum. Five albums of Willy's photos from the 1st WW were taken to the U.S.A. and have now disappeared. I am investigating his estate this very day to try and find out who had access to his memrobilia and hope to have some answers tonight. There was an exhibition in the late eighties in Texas in one of the museums in Dallas devoted to Willy. If you require further details, I will look them up in my files.

I hope to start a thread on Toni Raab from Willy's J40 as I read on the forums many statements about him, which seem to contradict the information that I have on him. I hope the members who made statements will join me in the debate.

Regards

Lawrence

Frank_Olynyk · 3 May 2007, 06:32 AM

Lawrence,

Thank you very much. Another problem in my files resolved.

Frank.

Roadhog · 5 May 2007, 08:12 AM

Dear Lawrence, I am currently writing a WWI aviation novel that features a jewish pilot as one of its main characters. May I from time to time confer with you regarding the plot to make sure that I have things right?

The pilot, Solomon, has already evolved quite a bit. He has gone from being killed in the last dogfight of the book (late October 1918) to getting heavily damaged in that fight only to crash land in the midst of an advancing American infantry unit where he asks for political asylum. Please advise. Maj. Scott Price, USAR (Retired) or just plain old 'tired"

Lawrence Milner · 6 May 2007, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roadhog

Dear Lawrence, I am currently writing a WWI aviation novel that features a jewish pilot as one of its main characters. May I from time to time confer with you regarding the plot to make sure that I have things right?

The pilot, Solomon, has already evolved quite a bit. He has gone from being killed in the last dogfight of the book (late October 1918) to getting heavily damaged in that fight only to crash land in the midst of an advancing American infantry unit where he asks for political asylum. Please advise. Maj. Scott Price, USAR (Retired) or just plain old 'tired"

Dear Roadhog,
I will do my best, but the only Jewish pilot that I know anything about is

Willy Rosenstein. The other pilot,that I am researching, Kurt Katzenstein, was baptized at the age of twelve so wasn't Jewish by religion but by race (both his parents were Jewish).
One thing that is a little known fact is that Jews were not able to become officers in the first WW in Germany, unless they converted. Willy did not convert, but because he was already instructing officers in the German Army how to fly in 1911 at the age of nineteen, I guess that the Germans made an exception in his case. Both Hermann Göring and

Carl Degelow thought he was an exceptional pilot.

Immo_Frese · 6 May 2007, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lawrence Milner

One thing that is a little known fact is that Jews were not able to become officers in the first WW in Germany, unless they converted.

Lawrence, as far as I know, there were a lot of german jewish officers during WW1.

It is true that the kingdom of Bavaria was the only german state who allowed jews to become officers (of the Reserve) in the army in the prewar era between 1885 - 1914. But with the outbreak of war in 1914 even Prussia and all the other german states abolished this prohibition.

Immo

6 May 2007, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lawrence Milner

One thing that is a little known fact is that Jews were not able to become officers in the first WW in Germany, unless they converted.

Very true, a prime example being Lt.Wilhelm Frankl, the only Jewish Recepient of the Poue Le Merite.

Roadhog · 8 May 2007, 09:38 AM

Ironically, according to his biography, Anne Frank's father served as a German artillery officer during World War I. So obviously exceptions were made. Any comments? Roadhog

Epee · 8 May 2007, 12:18 PM

As I understand it the status of Jews in the Kaiser's Germany was rather complex. Officially a "Christian" nation Jews were often excluded from certain "rights" of citizenship. Being made up of several kingdoms the rights of Jews would vary depending upon which state they called home. Likewise military status could further vary depending on their membership in the standing Imperial Forces, a kingdoms forces, or in the reserve.

FOKKERJ · 8 May 2007, 07:24 PM

I could be wrong, I don't believe that there would be any reason during October 1918 that Soloman would ask for or be granted political assylum for religious beliefs, from German citizenship to American protection. Just an observation from an observer! Please, anyone correct me if otherwise. RESPECTFULLY, FOKKERJ P.S. I think he would be just another P.O.W.!