MvR's last pull on his Spandau

Laserlloyd · 13 November 2009, 04:26 AM

Dave,

Great stuff, one more thing I found interesting that you had mentioned that there would have been a letter stamped on the trigger lock (under the gun number) as in the photo from "The Red Baron's Last flight" page 67 image D.

As reported the firing pin is broken. The question that came up is which trigger lock is this A, B or C? That's right as I found out that Each gun had it's on field box that contained three trigger locks for that gun. It would have made more sense that the trigger lock was the A lock and the B and C lock would have been in the field box.

As mentioned that as part of the armistice the trigger lock would have been broken to disable the gun and this would also include any trigger locks found in their field box.

So now we know that there are three trigger locks and the one in the photo from the gun or the field box? As mentioned by Dave that you can see in the photos I posted of the guns that the "cocking/clearing handle in the forward position, which means the trigger lock has already been removed" so were did this trigger lock come from?

Lloyd...

Laserlloyd · 13 November 2009, 05:14 AM

To show what I was talking about Dave has a photo of one of his trigger locks and you can see the gun number and the trigger lock letter "A" on the flat surface. The A would be the first trigger locked used and the B and C would still be in the field box. To add, the B trigger lock would be used if there was a problem with the A trigger lock and would have been used in sequence A then B then finally C.

Lloyd...

BobPhil · 13 November 2009, 08:30 AM

LLoyd'

At our meeting and discussion at " The Guns " Dave's tent at DPR, I found a photo I had taken of Dave showing us the pull-lever on one of his guns. I scanned the photo and sent it to your site ( Fokkerdr1.com) Could you post it one the Drome so we all can it?....Thanks.....Bob

Laserlloyd · 13 November 2009, 09:04 AM

Here you go Bob.

This was taken with Dave holding the Pull-Handle next to Fred Murrin's gun's. I just wanted to point out that this is the correct position it's just that these two gun's are from the Vintage Aviator collection (replica). Also note the the cocking handle is in it proper position by the end of the gun.

Lloyd...

Laserlloyd · 13 November 2009, 09:11 AM

Here is something I fond on the No. 3 stoppage.

The Vickers Machine Gun: 1951 Vickers Manual Part 1

Lloyd...

SCMc · 13 November 2009, 10:11 AM

Dave,

Please do not take this question as argumentative. I know little about the guns of WWI, but I want to reconcile what I have seen with what you have written. If MvR had recharging handles in the cockpit ofhis DR.I's, why is he seen reaching over to charge his guns before taking off in the well known film?Were the in cockpit recharging handles a later modification?

Steve

BobPhil · 13 November 2009, 05:01 PM

Fellows,

Based on Dave's discription of the guns,jam,broken firing pin,and the operating procedure of the weapons what are we left with? .....he wouldn't have had to reach out of his cockpit to pound the gun trying to clear the jam,just a pull on the re-charge handle? Why was he seen leaning forward every time he fired those two or three bursts,being that close to May, would he really need to lean forward to aim? and what damage to what gun happened when?....Oh Boy!......Bob

Ginger. · 13 November 2009, 05:05 PM

Bushrod · 13 November 2009, 05:06 PM

On pg 64 of

TRBLF, the authors submit that MvR's face was thrown into the gun butts because he had, "loosened his safety harness so as to be able to reach forward to re-cock the machine gun each time it stopped." Can any DrI experts chime in here: 1)were shoulder restraints standard in the DrI? 2)in a crash landing, would shoulder restaints, even fully tightened, keep the pilot's head from hitting the gun butts? 3)would an experienced pilot wear the straps loose to be able to look around better?

Dan_San_Abbott · 13 November 2009, 05:50 PM

Hi Bushrod:
The Idflieg four strap, lap and shoulder safety harness was common to all fighter aircraft in use in 1918. They could be be adjusted the the pilot on the ground. They could not be adjusted in flight.
On the left seat belt was a steel plate with a locking cone riveted to the plate. On top of the locking cone was a eye drilled through top of the cone to receive the locking pin. The locking pin was fastened to the left strap with thong. On the end of the other three straps was a steel triangular plate with a hole to fit over the locking cone. With all three strap steel plates seated on the locking cone, the pin was pushed through to hole on the top of the locking cone and a the pilot is secured to the seat. There is no release to move forward as in modern seats, you are fixed in place. If the harness is loosely fitted, it will permit some forward movement, or to twist the body to look aft, this must be what MvR used, otherwise his face would not have hit the padded gun butts in front of him.
What I have found in discussions about the four point harness, was most thought its purpose was to pervent the pilot from falling out of the aircraft if his was inverted, not as a crash harness. I think the intent of the engineers was, it was a safety crash harness.
Blue skies,
Dan-San