Wop May's other claims

James A. Pratt III · 16 March 2010, 01:42 PM

I am seeing if i can match up W.R. May's other claims with a German losses. I know:
16 May 18 Ltn F. Hubner J4 Fokker DrI 546/17 POW G/5/8
27 May 18 LVG "completely burnt" unit unk G/5/11 POW
12 Aug 18 D7 OOC claim could be one of two J53 losses this day in a fight with 209 and 41 squadrons or a damaged aircraft that flew home
15 Sep 18 possibly Ltn H Quittenburg J28w KIA in a fight with 209 squadron
21 Sep 18 possibly Vfw e Ritter J27 shotdown unhurt by May or Lt G. Knight of 209 Squadron. However, some sources have Ritter WIA on 15 Sep. A Ltn Schmitt J27 was WIA on 21 Sep 18. In this combat May's aircraft was damaged beyond repair. This could be the U?C claim by the Ace Ltn Klimke of J27.
Any help would be welcome. Thanks in advance.

Graeme · 16 March 2010, 04:29 PM

James

16 May 1918 = Ltn Hans Fedor Hubner, Jasta 4, Pow

27 May 1918 = Vfw Jodicke + Uffz Jakobs, Schusta 1

1 July 1918 = possibly Vfw Georg Schalk, Jasta 34b, Kia

12 August 1918 = Uffz Emil Possin, Jasta 53, Wia; the other Jasta 53 loss on this date was Offz.Stv. Fritz Blumenthal who was shot down and taken prisoner south-west of Proyart, the victim of Capt R M Foster

21 September 1918 = Ltn

Rudolf Klimke, Jasta 27, Wia (shoulder) or Ltn Schmitt, Jasta 27, Wia (knee); claims were made by May (Fokker DVII out of control) and Lt G R Knight (Fokker DVII crashed)

Ltn.d.R. Hilmar Quittenbaum was KIA over Arleux-Douai on 15 September 1918; I have this as being by 1st Lt T L Moore, 148 USAS (Fokker DVII crashed (?) 18:45 south-west of Arleux).

At the moment I have no other matches for May's claims.

Graeme

James A. Pratt III · 23 March 2010, 02:38 PM

Thanks Graeme! Do you know what happened to Jodicke & Jakobs of SS 1? Were they WIA KIA or POW? They are not in CGAS. Also according to BABS Klimke was WIA by 205 Squadrons DH 4s or possibly BFs later on that day. Finally, it looks like

Wop May was a pretty good by Britsh standards pilot. 13 claims and it looks like 6 verified, shared, possible or probable real world victories.

James A. Pratt III · 31 March 2010, 04:01 PM

or 7 if Quittenburg was killed in a fight with 209 squadron as in BABS.

Rob Romeor · 5 April 2010, 09:46 AM

Which if any of Wop's claims were OOC, Etc. This might further increase the validity of his claims (i.e., Claims of Kills vs. Victories).

James A. Pratt III · 6 April 2010, 08:11 AM

On the aces section lists 4 of his 13 claims as OOC.

R Gannon · 7 April 2010, 06:28 PM

Here's my take.

16 May 18 - Ltn Hubner Js 4 - yes but victory shared with Capt Edwards & Lt Taylor.

27 May 18 - apparently Vfw Jodicke & Uffz Jacobs of SS1. Not in COTGAS, but as noted by Rick himself, the none kia section is only a partial listing. One will not find for example the FAA 202 loss of Maulen & Ley POW in July 17 - G 57. I can point to several more.

Also Lt Todd & Lt Liversage of 70 Sqn are also in the mix in regards this particular downing - LVG in flames Ribemont (Brit lines SW of Albert) at 1155!

1 July 18 - Vfw schalk kia Js 34 possibly victim of May but more probably victim of Capt Maxwell & Capt Crowe of 56 Sqn, two proven airfighters who together crashed a Tripe in pieces same vicinity.

12 Aug 18 - 41 Sqn get my vote.

15 Sep 18 - Qutterbaum KIA Js 28 - possibly May, or indeed 148 Sqn, but more probably victim of 73 Sqn: who crashed a number of DVII's this general loc.

21 sep 18 - I think 209 Sqn, 57 Sqn, Js 2 & Js 27 are all in the mix here. Capt May might have wounded Klimke but Lt Knight also has claim. Frommherz, Noltenius (zlg) & Klimke all have Sopwith claims which would seem to relate to 209 Sqn - but of course May's shot up Camel is only contender. Suspect this is fight in which Baumer baled out following three claims against 57 Sqn - only one loss however. Baumer in turn claimed by 57 Sqn flight.

As always, times, in relation to German losses would help greatly in sorting these issues out.

I would always suggest caution in regards cynicism in regards Brit claims - present picture of German downings as shown in COTGAS is in my estimation 40-50 % shy of real picture. No doubt there is a heavy overclaim, but my research would suggest that OOC's aside, it is no where near as dramatic as some would have us believe.

Cheers Russ

Graeme · 8 April 2010, 01:16 PM

Hi Russ

Nice to see you back. Just sorting out a few glitches on the new laptop but when I've got all my files transferred safe and sound I'll have another look into May's claims and see if there's anything more I can add.

Graeme

R Gannon · 8 April 2010, 07:16 PM

Hi Graeme

Good to know that there are those who appreciate my contribution. As always there is scope for interpolation in the who got who diciplin.

Actually re 15 Sep - one 73 Sqn patrol bounced 10 'red' DVII's and Baldwin crashed one with red & white diagnol stripes! Sounds a bit like Udet. But of course neither Udet or Bodenchatz admit to anything like this.

Cheers Russ

Gregvan · 8 April 2010, 09:13 PM

Hi Russ,

The "red & white diagonal stripes" could mean just about anyone. By 15 September 1918, Udet was no longer flying his D.VII with the diagonally striped top wing (red & white, or black & white?); it was long gone. He was flying D.VII F 4253/18, which had a red fuselage and horizontal tail but regular "lozenge" fabric wings. But then, you don't have to believe what I say about Udet; no one else on this forum does.

Greg