Billy Bishop Again

[Barker]

Womit verdient er sein Brot?

[wings]

Remember McCudden!!!

[Billy_Bishop]

Womit verdient er sein Brot?

With his brain!

[Barker]

Ja!

Al, as it happens, I am a fan.

Until bedrock proof surfaces (doubtful as hell) think William Avery did pretty much what he said he did.

-Combat is a great judge.
-I like my neighbors to the North.


-Barker

[Billy_Bishop]

This is of course the problem. I too would like to see better proof that shows he DID what he claimed.

That is however also unlikely to surface either. So as far as the naysayers are concerned, without proof he did, they look to the negative and say he didn't.

Never mind that there was apparently enough proof 85 years ago. Since the enemy denied (during wartime) that it happened, that is enough for them. Even though, the enemy references the WRONG date.

But no, we can't point that out them. Obviously the fastidious bookkeeping Germans had it right, even if they did reference the wrong date.

VBR,

Al Lowe

[Billy_Bishop]

What? no rebuttal to my posts?

VBR,

Al Lowe

[Kory_Clark]

Nope you won.

[Billy_Bishop]

You know, there are times when I really miss Jasta.

VBR,

Al Lowe

[manzol]

I'm reading Horses Don't Fly, a memoir by Frederick Libby, MC (an American who flew with the RFC--14 confirmed victories). He refers to Bishop (though not by name) in a most unflattering manner (pps. 227-229).
"Every day in the RFC, all active combat squadrons receive a comminique giving a resume of the previous day's action. We have one pilot in our wing who writes a wicked report. He must be good, but not quite as good as his last report, which I have just read."
Liddy then goes on to give a scathing recap of BB's June '17 raid (misplacing the German air field--at least according to BB advocates).
"God Almighty! Excuse me while I vomit. I have been in this man's flying corps for almost two years. We have waited over the Hun's air field for him to come up and he always does, but it is not that easy....This and other reports by the same pilot are the only ones in almost two years that have ever upset me, because all the RFC boys bend over backwards in reporting their victories. They never make this kind of claim, where there is no chance to confirm...when I think of Albert Ball [recently kia and a friend of Libbys]and his conservative reports, the kid must be amused or disgusted if he knows about this."
Later, he mentions he's just been credited with two "Huns"..."nothing to compare with a certain pilot in our wing. He is still raising hell on paper. No one seems to see him do it, but if his arm holds out he will pass Ball's record, which seems to be the general idea."

A few comments:
Libby wrote the memoir shortly before his death (1970) "from memory" (no mention of a diary, log books, research, etc.). Given the amount of detail, if accurate, the book would constitute an amazing feat of recollection.
Does anyone know of other "contemporary" works which mention pilots' views of BB's claims?
Were such "communiques" actually circulated among the RFC squadrons?
Libby apparently idolized Ball and this may have played a part in his opinions, but (correct me if I'm in error) a memoir penned in the late '60's would have pre-dated the Bishop controversy, giving veracity to the depth (if not the accuracy) of Libby's feelings.

Just more grist for Al's mill.
Manzol

[Billy_Bishop]

Yup, I knew about this one. So far as I know, NO ONE else has published anything like this. At least not anyone who WAS there.

As for Libby finding out, if I recall correctly, I believe his squadron was based at the same aerodrome as 60 Squadron was, so it would not take much for Libby to hear about it. If you read Libby's book, though, you'll notice that he greatly exagerates Bishop's claims.

Apparently Bishop's ghost writer wasn't the only one trying to increase Bishop's actual score.

VBR,

Al