Wing Flappers

jempie · 13 April 2006, 12:47 PM

Hi AAC leader

I have a Dutch bookwork in which someof the prinicples are to find with the same above picture!
Seems it was a modell for a real size contrucxtion which was flown with succes indeed at St Petersburg, 1883!

Inside was foreseen to built in a very powerfull steammachine...which was activating the flapwings and three propellors (!)
Two propellers were at each side under the wings fitted!
The right top (bowtop) was open , to let enter the air for the fire of steammachine and crew!
>The text mentioned that at tail end (with propeller) only the left stabilisation deveice is drawed to let see that propeller, but that such second was right of it too!
Thus this drawing is on that point incomplete!
Through the air in movement, this machine , tehey tell would have thorugh the smoke and escaping steam give the impression (like the light tail) of a "comet" to be!
Under the machine is a weight ftted to keep the machine in equilibrity...

But's all I have!

VBR

Jempie

P.S. I have so many books and only today I thought once to look into this one!Not an interesting one and quite little extra info in it to find on this subject!

However they give riference the text is basd on, and picture is extracted from Sc. A. (= Scientific American)

AAC Cadet Leader · 15 April 2006, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aerohydro

Hi Guys

Here's another photo of an ornithopter flapping its way through the air. This time round, its the George White ornithopter, which was tested at St Augustine, Florida circa 1927-28. (See posts 107, 108 etc of this thread.) The strong sepia-tone nature to the image is due to it being an old newpaper photograph that has aged fairly badly over the decades.

Quite an evocative little image, undeniably faked, but none-the-less one that's quite pleasing to see.

Cheers,
Paul

aerohydro,
Do you have the article that goes with the faked sepia photos of George White's ornithopter? Yes, that is an evocative image, due to its realism I think.

The photo link from post #107 is broken. I'm glad you mentioned them again though, because a month or so ago, I was looking for that third link you have on post #108, and couldn't find it. That image still haunts me. It is so dramatic and tells such a story of sad defeat of George White's hard work and bravery. As the assistants gather around his broken ornithopter and broken body, the powerful storm moves in in the background. Is this an original photograph that you own, and may I use it to make a painting from?
It is good to know that he lived until 1980, but very sad that his son disposed of his creations.

AAC Cadet Leader · 15 April 2006, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jempie

Hi AAC leader

I have a Dutch bookwork in which someof the prinicples are to find with the same above picture!
Seems it was a modell for a real size contrucxtion which was flown with succes indeed at St Petersburg, 1883!

How successful could it have been, jempie?

Quote:

>The text mentioned that at tail end (with propeller) only the left stabilisation deveice is drawed to let see that propeller, but that such second was right of it too!
Thus this drawing is on that point incomplete!
Through the air in movement, this machine , tehey tell would have thorugh the smoke and escaping steam give the impression (like the light tail) of a "comet" to be!
Under the machine is a weight ftted to keep the machine in equilibrity..

Difficult to tell if this machine is coming or going.

aerohydro · 17 April 2006, 02:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jempie

Hi AAC leader

I have a Dutch bookwork in which someof the prinicples are to find with the same above picture! Seems it was a modell for a real size contrucxtion which was flown with succes indeed at St Petersburg, 1883!
....
However they give riference the text is basd on, and picture is extracted from Sc. A. (= Scientific American)

Hello Jempie

Many thanks for this new information about Professor Baranowski's Steam Flying Machine. Given the current dearth of info that's at hand about this machine, this is a big step forward! In the book you refer to, how specific is the "Scientific American" reference? - does it happen to give a volume number or issue date for the magazine?

If there was such a reference, then that would be very useful.

Cheers,
Paul

aerohydro · 18 April 2006, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAC Cadet Leader

aerohydro,
Do you have the article that goes with the faked sepia photos of George White's ornithopter? ... I was looking for that third link you have on post #108, and couldn't find it. That image still haunts me. It is so dramatic and tells such a story of sad defeat of George White's hard work and bravery. As the assistants gather around his broken ornithopter and broken body, the powerful storm moves in in the background. Is this an original photograph that you own, and may I use it to make a painting from?

Hello AAC Cadet Leader

Unfortunately I don't have the article that accompanied the sepia photos. They were cropped from a larger image which did include a partial caption (a few incomplete lines, but that's all). No full article, and certainly nothing to indicate as to when and where the image had appeared in print. Sorry.

I, too, admire the 'crash' photo that's in post #108. Given that the photo was of an unplanned (and certainly an unexpected) event, the photographer did a wonderful job of framing the image and incorporating the various elements into it. A superb image, IMHO.

The 'crash' photo, along with a few other photos of the ornithopter, was scanned out of a photo album that now belongs to one of George White's relations (either his son, or grandson, if I remember). The scans had been sent to a Florida-based enthusiast who was then kind enough to forward them onto me.

Please send me a PM through this site, containing your email address, and I'll send you a larger, more detailed version of the 'crash' photo, along with a few others that may help you with the rendering of the ornithopter wings.

Cheers,
Paul

AAC Cadet Leader · 18 April 2006, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aerohydro

Please send me a...

Will do. Thanks, Paul!

aerohydro · 13 July 2006, 10:10 PM

Hi All

I came across the following bit of news which you may be interested in:

A man-carrying ornithopter, designed by a team at the University of Toronto, made a short flapping wing flight on July 8th, 2006. The aircraft was propelled up to take-off speed by a small jet fitted to the underside of the fuselage, but the take-off itself and the flight were acheived using the flapping wings alone. The flight lasted for 14 seconds and covered 300m.

At this website you can access a number of photos of the flight (which ended in a crash!), as well as a video.

Cheers,
Paul

AAC Cadet Leader · 13 July 2006, 10:36 PM

Cool news, Paul! Thanks for it. My computer for some reason won't play the videos on the web link, so tell me please, does the crash total it completely?

Did they determine that the 330 meters and 14 seconds was "successful" ?

aerohydro · 15 July 2006, 06:52 PM

Hi AAC Cadet Leader

The aircraft suffered only slight damage. Towards the end of the flight, the ornithopter had encountered a cross-wind, which it had difficulty in handling (the aircraft has no lateral control). Eventually one of the wing tips made contact with the ground and the plane then spun round and came to a halt. As it did, the front nose wheel collapsed, with the nose of the plane then resting on the runway. No major damage, but there would be quite a few bits and pieces that would need to be inspected and replaced before it could be tested again.

You'll see the title that I've given to this posting. The initial reports concerning this flight,that I had come across, mentioned the jet being used to propel the ornithopter up to flight speed, but not about it being in use during the flight itself. A PDF report about the flight has now been written up - it can be accessed here - and in it, its clearly stated that the jet engine was operating during the whole flight. So, its not a true ornithopter flight, but rather one done with some jet-power assistance. The report indicates that the flapping wings lifted perhaps 600lb of the plane's 770lb weight, the rest being accounted for by the jet.

Close to success, but not close enough to actually claim success. That elusive "first" is still out there for someone else to chase.

Cheers,
Paul

AAC Cadet Leader · 21 July 2006, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aerohydro

Hi AAC Cadet Leader

The aircraft suffered only slight damage. Towards the end of the flight, the ornithopter had encountered a cross-wind, which it had difficulty in handling (the aircraft has no lateral control). Eventually one of the wing tips made contact with the ground and the plane then spun round and came to a halt. As it did, the front nose wheel collapsed, with the nose of the plane then resting on the runway. No major damage, but there would be quite a few bits and pieces that would need to be inspected and replaced before it could be tested again.

You'll see the title that I've given to this posting. The initial reports concerning this flight,that I had come across, mentioned the jet being used to propel the ornithopter up to flight speed, but not about it being in use during the flight itself. A PDF report about the flight has now been written up - it can be accessed here - and in it, its clearly stated that the jet engine was operating during the whole flight. So, its not a true ornithopter flight, but rather one done with some jet-power assistance. The report indicates that the flapping wings lifted perhaps 600lb of the plane's 770lb weight, the rest being accounted for by the jet.

Close to success, but not close enough to actually claim success. That elusive "first" is still out there for someone else to chase.

Cheers,
Paul

Thanks Paul! Reading the description of their flight almost sounds like a high tech version of the Wright brothers first flight at Kitty Hawk.