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Go Back   The Aerodrome Forum > Archives > 1999


1999 Closed threads from 1999 (read only)

 
 
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Old 17 September 1999, 10:41 PM   #1
Soderbaum
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In the book Pour le Merite Flieger by Walter Zuerl
from 1938(reprint 1977).
the author says as follows:
On 4 nov 1918 Dörr shot down his last victims nr 35 and 36....On 19 Januar 1919 he RECIEVED afterwards his well earned Pour le Merite.
Can anyone comment the validaty of this..?
Was it possible to recieve it this way ?
Did Dörr wear his possible PlM on photos after
the War ?
Zuerl also reported that Dörr after his death in
a chrash 1928 was buried at the Invaliden cementary in Berlin, but his "Ordens" was hanged
up in his homechurch Dubenigken in Eastpreussia..
Thanks in advance
Gunnar
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Old 18 September 1999, 05:00 AM   #2
Red Devil
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No, according to the series, Aviation Awards of Imperial Germany, Dorr never received his award before or after the end of the war. Hope this helps.
 
Old 18 September 1999, 07:26 AM   #3
Soderbaum
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Not mentioned in this Forum biographie of Dörr
is his birthplace and place of death.
Zuerl gives his birthplace as Blindgallen in East
Preussia. He was killed when flying in the dark as a pilot for Luft Hansa on the route from Köln to Berlin on a Junkers G31 No D1473 with the name "Rheinland". The aircraft chrashed at Letzingen near Stendal by unknown reason. When the aircraft presumly tried to land it runned in som trees and was badly damaged. The petrol soon erupted the aircraft in flames. The crew(3) died in the flames but the only passanger survived badly wounded.
I hope that this is a true story by Zuerl...!
Gunnar
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Old 18 September 1999, 09:08 PM   #4
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I think Dörr belonged to the people with "self-awarded" Plm. I found Zuerl very often telling wrong stories but older Anglo-American sources quotate him without every criticism.
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Old 19 September 1999, 08:33 PM   #5
Reinout
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Dear Soderbaum,

Like Red Devil said, Neal O'Connor includes Doerr in the section on fighter pilots who didn't receive the PlM because the war ended too soon. That is correct, since the PlM took longer at the end of the war to be approved, at least two months and regular/active officers were favoured above reserve officers so the latter ones could get them after over two months! Doerr was a GMMC winner and afterwards promoted to officer rank (sometime after his 20th victory, don't know his exact score at the time) and was instantly eligible for the PlM but it would take longer for him than for others and he just didn't make it.

I have never seen any pictures of Doerr with a PlM and in fact I have only seen one such picture where a non-PlM knight actually wore one: Hermann Frommherz (29 to 33 according to various sources) who tried to obtain a PlM from Prussia as late as 1929! Without the Kaiser's signature, there would be no PlM awards and Carl Degelow was thus the last man to be granted a PlM on 9 Nov 1918. If Doerr wore a PlM after the war, I'd like to see a picture of that. I have a photo of Werner Preusss with a PlM touched in by the photographer, did Preuss wear a PlM after the war?

Did anybody else?

To return to your question Soderbaum, Doerr didn't receive it in 1919. No possible way.

Kind regards,

Reinout
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Old 20 September 1999, 09:06 AM   #6
Soderbaum
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Thankyou all,
for contributing on this issue. I was personally
a bit suspicoius about this statement. If Zuerl had been true it would have been interesting..
The fact Hannes point out that Zuerl sometimes
tell the wromg stories even make the analyzis of his book going from criticism to scepticism. Can
we trust anything of his work?
Or should the book been trown in the trashcan, or
put beside Whitehouse books in the obscyre part of
your bookshelf..
Personally I think Dörr presumly had some bitternes of not recieving the PlM as the highest
German scorer not to got it..
Regarding Degelows award I have some other German
soutces published after the War that says he recieved the PlM on 8 Nov. Neckel recieved it the
same DAY and is mentioned after Degelow....
Could that depend on N comes after D in the
alfabet or did Neckel recieved it after Degelow..?
Or did they recieved it simultanesly..?
If the Pour le Merite awards was given a chronical
number it could explain the correct answer..
As I asked before and Reinout to, Does someone
has any postwar photos Dörr ??
It would be really appreciated

Gunnar

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