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Old 27 March 2024, 02:19 PM   #1
CjBobrow
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Lohner B.I flight question

Hey there fellow Forumites

I'm seeking insights on the Austro-Hungarian Lohner B.I reconnaissance aircraft's operational capabilities during World War I, focusing on a specific mission profile.

Aircraft Specifications:

Model: Lohner B.I
Engine: 90 hp Austro-Daimler
Maximum Speed: 115 km/h (72 mph)

Fuel Consumption Calculation:
I've calculated the possible hourly fuel consumption for the Lohner B.I with its 90 hp engine, using the typical specific fuel consumption for early aviation engines based upon (0.55 lb/hp/hr) and the density of aviation gasoline (6.7 lb/gal). Here's the breakdown:

Specific Fuel Consumption: 0.55 lb/hp/hr
Engine Power: 90 hp
Fuel Density: 6.7 lb/gal

Fuel consumption per hour in pounds = Engine Power * Specific Fuel Consumption = 90 hp * 0.55 lb/hp/hr
Fuel consumption per hour in gallons = Fuel consumption per hour in pounds / Fuel Density

The estimated fuel consumption rate for the Lohner B.I is approximately 7.39 gallons per hour.

Mission Scenario:

Flight Distance: Text suggests 300 kilometers, likely one-way from Nisko to Warsaw, though I am sure this was a roundtrip flight. (actual distance is Distance: 206.2 km / 128.13 mi so I am not sure where they actually took off from as the airfield could have been closer to Warsaw) This was in August 1914.
Flight Duration: 5 hours.
Fuel Requirement: Based on the above calculation, about 36.95 gallons for the trip.

Questions:

What would be the Lohner B.I's operational range with this fuel consumption and capacity?

How plausible is a 5-hour continuous flight for 300 km one way, 600 km roundtrip given these figures?

Are there recorded instances of similar long-duration flights by Lohner B.I aircraft in WWI?

Additional technical information on the Lohner B.I's fuel capacity and endurance would be highly valuable.

Any insights, historical examples, or technical data you can provide will be instrumental for a historical research project.

Thank you in advance for your thoughts
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Old 28 March 2024, 01:20 AM   #2
YavorD
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Rated power is used during take off and initial climb to a desired cruising altitude, probably less than 1/2 hour at full rated power. During a long flight the aircraft cruise power is about 60 ... 70 % rated power.
For a 600 km round trip the necessary flight endurance must be at least 7 hours or more. The crew will not navigate a straight line course but follow recognisable ground features like roads, rivers and villages.
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Old 28 March 2024, 11:56 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CjBobrow View Post

Mission Scenario:

Flight Distance: Text states 300 kilometers... Nisko to Warsaw... actual distance is Distance: 206.2 km / 128.13 mi This was in August 1914.

Flight Duration: 5 hours.
Does anyone have details on the fuel tank capacity of the following (1914) machines:
  • Albatros B.I
  • Aviatik B.I
  • Lohner B.I
  • DFW B.I
My supposition is they all had nearly the same fuel capacity.

The differences then would be the engine used and aerodynamic qualities and of course the weather/atmospheric/wind conditions.

Still trying to understand the distance actually flown but setting that aside for the moment...
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Old 28 March 2024, 04:41 PM   #4
YavorD
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LVG B
Empty 765 kg
Loaded 1132 kg
Load 367 kg (other sources 320 ... 348 ... 420 kg)
Crew 160 kg
Equipment 10 kg
Fuel / Oil up to 197 kg

Albatros B
Empty 752 kg
Loaded 1197 kg (probably 3-bay DD AUW, less for 2-bay DD and DE)
Load 445 kg (other sources 320 ... 348 ... 360 kg)
Crew 160 kg
Equipment 10 kg
Fuel / Oil up to 285 kg

DFW B
Empty 650 kg
Loaded 1015 kg
Load 365 kg (other sources 220 ... 320 kg)
Crew 160 kg
Equipment 10 kg
Fuel / Oil up to 195 kg

Aviatik B
Empty 668 kg
Loaded 1090 kg
Load 422 kg (other sources 320 kg)
Crew 160 kg
Equipment 10 kg
Fuel / Oil up to 252 kg

Usual load of fuel / oil for a B-type was 150 ... 160 kg.
Some aircraft, however, can cary up to 250 kg.

I have no data at hand for Lohner.
Endurance of 5 hours should be possible with 250 kg fuel, distance up to 400 km in perfect visual flight conditions.

Best regards,
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Old 29 March 2024, 03:36 AM   #5
AndersJ
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Regarding the range calculation, if we calculate the average speed using the stated flight time of 5 h and the 200 to 300 km flight distance, this works out to only in between 40-60 km/h. Granted, they probably did not fly in straight line and of course spent time climbing etc. However, this is still a far cry from the top speed 115 km/h, which suggests they flew at a lower speed.

In addition, just like Yavor suggested, they probably used some kind of cruise setting to extend the range. But since we donít have any data on this, we just have to pick a number, and say they instead elected to fly a bit slower at 90 km/h, this would increase range a lot:

Using the cube law to work out the power needed, assuming 90 hp gives 115 km/h this means that only about 43 hp would be needed to attain 90 km/h (This is a simplification since it does not take induced drag into account but should be good enough for a ballpark number anyway).

So this would give us a fuel consumption of around 3.53 G/h for 90 km/h, compared to 7.39 G/h for 115 km/h.

And 90/3.53= 25.5 km/G while 115/7.39=15.6 km/G so quite an improvement.

Another way of looking at it would be to use the stated 5 hour duration and conclude that flying at 115 km/h would consume 36.95 gallons and get you a range of 575 km, while flying at 90 km/h and consuming 36.95 gallons would give you double the endurance and a range of 942 km.

But these are of course only the theoretical numbers with no margins, and when planning the mission they would probably have deducted certain percentages for a reserve etc. For example, in WW2 range calculations Iíve seen deductions like 10% for combat and 20 % reserve, so only about 70% of the fuel capacity was used to determine the operational range.

Best wishes,

Anders
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Old 29 March 2024, 01:30 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YavorD View Post
LVG B

Usual load of fuel / oil for a B-type was 150 ... 160 kg.
Some aircraft, however, can cary up to 250 kg.

I have no data at hand for Lohner.
Endurance of 5 hours should be possible with 250 kg fuel, distance up to 400 km in perfect visual flight conditions.

Best regards,
Yavor
Thank you for the list it is helpful... though the figures of fuel/oil suggest huge fuel tanks, I will explain.

I have to say my calculations of converting the given fuel weight listed into gallons is problematic and cannot be correct.

Converting the kg. weight to gallons requires the knowledge of what gasoline density was at the time. I'm seeing density of 0.71 to 0.74 kg/L being given.

Based upon information I have gleaned for 1913/1914-era automobile gasoline, it seems improbable so I am not sure where I went wrong with my calculations.

Also what was the typical fuel to oil carrying ratio since the figure only provides the total, I can tell you my cars but thats no help here.

This is why I was looking for the capacity in liquid measurement on the fuel tanks of any of the following (1914) machines:
Albatros B.I
Aviatik B.I
Lohner B.I
DFW B.I
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