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Go Back   The Aerodrome Forum > Archives > 2000

2000 Closed threads from 2000 (read only)

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Old 2 September 2000, 12:38 PM   #1
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Dan-San Abbott, I would be very appreciative to hear your views on the purporrted Barfoot-Saunt "Salvage Report" posted at,5,26
As I have noted on 'the other forum,' the provenance is via a collector who the curent knows was in correspondence with Rodney Gerard.
Old 2 September 2000, 03:50 PM   #2
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Stefen I would be most suspect with anything that was connected to Rodney Gerrard and his collection. Before I would invest my hard earned money I would require an inspectionand evaluation by an expert.
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Old 3 September 2000, 12:46 PM   #3
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Good evening, Dan-San Abbott-
Thanks for the caveat. I hadn't actually been thinking of acquiring the piece, only wondering of its value with respect to the Voss matter(s).
Gratefully yours,
Old 4 September 2000, 06:13 AM   #4
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As posted in the previous thread, but bears repeated (IMHO):

I would have a very hard time accepting anything that passed through the grubby paws of Rodney Gerrard. Also have a fundamental distrust of "discovered documents" with hyphenated names.

Do the words "Cockburn-Lange" strike a familiar note?


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Old 5 September 2000, 09:53 AM   #5
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Unfortunately, there is a well known dealer on the web that is selling salvage reports that originated from Rodney Gerard. I purchased a small piece of fabric from him (I refuss to give his name because I don't want to advertise for him) that came from a Barfoot-Saunt salvage report on MvR's Fokker 425/17. From the moment that I received the fabric I suspected it to be a fake. Fortunately, a very helpful Aerodrome forumite assisted me in researching the fabric further and I found that it WAS a fake. I sent the fabric back to the dealer and demanded a refund. Thankfully he gave me my money back. I also sent the dealer several documents that proved his salvage reports and fabric pieces were fake (the most damning evidence is the great article written by Allen Toelle entitled "Goodbye to all that Red." Unfortunately, the dealer is still advertising these items on his website. The moral of the story is, don't waste your money unless you really do your research first and truly know what you are buying. I won't buying or believe anything that has Barfoot-Saunt on it or can be traced back to Rodney Gerard. It is sad that someone would corrupt history for a buck.


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Old 5 September 2000, 01:01 PM   #6
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Phil's caveats are appropriate, but I am still confused about the status of Barfoot-Saunt items as I am led to understand that Rodney Gerrard used another name to fabricate reports in the manner of the real Barfoot-Saunt.
So the question remains what readers think about the item that Tobias Gibson posted in the earlier thread.
Thanking all in advance,
Old 5 September 2000, 10:53 PM   #7
Dave F
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The 'other' name used was 'A Willcox'.
Old 6 September 2000, 08:29 AM   #8
Tobias Gibson
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I took another look at the report. I believe both the typed in text and the scanned image are part of the same report.


The following are major nagging points which suggest the document to be a fraud:
  • Note that the upper and middle wing were not "salved" or reovered, yet there is a sketch of the right upper wing. Also note that the aileron on the upper wing is a sketch of a later model Dr I and not of the earlier models or the prototype.

    The author also states it is one of the triplane scouts active in the area. In fact, at the time of Voß death it may have been the only triplane in the area.

    There is no reference of comparison to Wolff's death plane. Note also the date change and lack of initials that usually accompany a change in an official document.

Still the document looks cool and adds to the legend surrounding Werner Voß

[center] <table> <tr> <td> </td> <td> Tobias Gibson, OTFM
[email protected][/email]
48 Kills: Werner Voß
</td> </tr> </table>
Old 6 September 2000, 08:24 PM   #9
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Lt.Alan Wilcox was the ficticious chacter invented by Rodney Gerrard that did all the intelligence reports on captured or shot down German and also Austrian aircraft on little note paper and in some cases RFC forms. I had for review the collection the Dr. Glen Merrill purchased. These and others were later studied by Alan Toelle from which he wrote his report. I have a copy of this"Incident Report" To the attention of Lt.Barfoot-Saunt. wing Intelligence, 1 Area Hq. (Advanced)RFC He has several pages, typed and hand-writen. It is phony!
I examined the fabric swatches and they were all doped after they were cut to. After doping the swatches shrank with the result that theyarns protruded from the edges. It was obvious to me he knew nothing about how aicraft are doped. What was really silly he used a small brush that left camel hairs in the doped. Dumb! I brought matter up a the "Over the Front Seminar in San Diego after a long discussion with Paul Leaman, the editor of Cross & Cockade he agreed to publish the findings. Another meeting at about midnight was held which was attended by about 10 or 12 people and the decision was made to publish the results of the scientific study by Alan Toelle. A lot of good people were swindled by Rodney Gerrard, some financially the rest historically cheated. Rodney Gerrard was the source of the blue and white Fok. DR.I from Jasta 18. The correct ciolors are red and white. Look at Sqadron Signals "FOKKER DR.I IN ACTION". I know I ruffle some feather but I can't stand by when I know it's BS.
Blue skies
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Old 7 September 2000, 12:47 AM   #10
Dave F
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So, reports TO Barfoot-Saunt are likely to be counterfeit, whereas the ones in the PRO authored by hi should be genuine ?

Wonder what the real colours on Albatros DV 1162/17 were then ? Or was it even 1162 ?

fascinating !



dsa, thoughts, barfootsaunt

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