Who shot down Ltn.d.R. Hugo Jöns?

[tcrean7828]

Mates,
Have a question for you all - Who shot down Ltn.d.R. Hugo Jöns?

Here is the info so far that I have:
2 Victories;
Shot down on 23 Sep 1917 the same day as Werner Voss.
Was the OzbV for Jasta 10 from 21 Sep until 16 Dec 1916.
Was assigned to Jasta 10, 17, 31, and 20 when he was KIA.
Killed over Dixmuiden.

Who shot him down and what were the circumstances????

cul

tcrean7828

tom:D

[Graeme]

Tom

My three ha'porth:

Flt Sub-Lt J P Hales, 9 Sqn RNAS, claimed to have destroyed an Albatros scout between Ostende and Dixmuide at about 08:15 (British time);

Flt Cdr S T Edwards, also 9 Sqn RNAS, claimed an Albatros scout that crashed north of Dixmuide at 08:20 (British time);

Flt Lt H F Beamish and Flt Sub-Lt G S Harrower, 3 Sqn RNAS, each claimed an Albatros scout out of control in the area of Middlekerke, about 10 Km north of Dixmuide, at 11:00 (British time).

Of these, I'd say either Hales or Edwards was responsible and of these two, most likely Edwards.

Graeme

[tcrean7828]

Tom

My three ha'porth:

Flt Sub-Lt J P Hales, 9 Sqn RNAS, claimed to have destroyed an Albatros scout between Ostende and Dixmuide at about 08:15 (British time);

Flt Cdr S T Edwards, also 9 Sqn RNAS, claimed an Albatros scout that crashed north of Dixmuide at 08:20 (British time);

Flt Lt H F Beamish and Flt Sub-Lt G S Harrower, 3 Sqn RNAS, each claimed an Albatros scout out of control in the area of Middlekerke, about 10 Km north of Dixmuide, at 11:00 (British time).

Of these, I'd say either Hales or Edwards was responsible and of these two, most likely Edwards.

Graeme

Mate,

Thanks for the info - just a quick question?

Where did you find this info?

cul

tcrean7828

tom:D

[Soderbaum]

Hi

Jöns/Joens was according to a German source brought down in Flames....It dont fits the descriptions given by the pilots from 9 N sq....

Does the combat report from Foncks victory exists..?

:huh:
Gunnar

[Graeme]

Hi Gunnar

I've got Fonck's claim on that date as being over a two-seater south of Houthulst, about 9 Km south-east of Dixmuide. Since this was his 14th victory, I reckon he would have been able to spot the difference between a two-seater and an Albatros scout; for that reason I discounted his claim.

I've got the following claims over aeroplanes identified as scouts on 23 September 1917:

2nd Lt R M Strang, 19 RFC, Albatros D OOC
2nd Lt F Watts + 2nd Lt E Ripley, 53 RFC, Albatros D OOC
2nd Lt P Wilson, 1 RFC, Albatros D OOC
07:50 Off Ostend, Flt Cdr S T Edwards, 9 RNAS, Albatros DV Crashed
08:15 Ostend - Dixmude, Flt Sub-Lt J P Hales, 9 RNAS, Albatros DIII Dest
08:20 N Dixmude, Flt Cdr S T Edwards, 9 RNAS, Albatros DV Crashed
11:00 Middlekerke, Flt Sub-Lt G S Harrower, 3 RNAS, Albatros DV OOC
11:00 Middlekerke, Flt Lt H F Beamish, 3 RNAS, Albatros DV OOC
11:25 NE Houthulst Forest, A/Flt Cdr W M Alexander, 10 RNAS, Albatros DV OOC
11:30 Westroosebeke, Flt Sub-Lt E J Bussell, 10 RNAS, Albatros DIII OOC
11:30 Westroosebeke, Flt Sub-Lt H J T Saint, 10 RNAS, Albatros DV OOC
12:00 Passchendaele, 2nd Lt A A N D Pentland, 19 RFC, Albatros D OOC
12:45 Zonnebeke - Langemarck, Capt A G Jones-Williams, 29 RFC, Albatros DIII OOC
15:30 SW Henin-Lietard, Lt W MacLanachan, 40 RFC, Albatros DV Crashed
16:25 Vitry, Sgt T F Stephenson + 1/AM S Platel, 11 RFC, Albatros DV OOC
16:25 Vitry, Capt A E McKeever + 2nd Lt L A Powell, 11 RFC, 2 x Albatros DV OOC
17:40 N Zonnebeke, Lt R T C Hoidge, 56 RFC, Pfalz DIII OOC
18:00 NE Ypres, 2nd Lt A P F Rhys Davids, 56 RFC, Albatros DV OOC
18:00 NE Ypres Salient, 2nd Lt A P F Rhys Davids, 56 RFC, Fokker DrI Captured
18:30 NW Lille, Capt E H Johnston + Lt J A Hone, 20 RFC, Albatros DV Crashed

With respect to the location of Dixmuide,

Houthulst Forest is 10 Km south-east
Westroosebeke 17 is Km south-east
Middelkerke is about 20 north
Passchendaele is about 20 Km south-east
Zonnebeke is 22 Km south-east
Ypres is 22 Km south
Ostend is almost 25 Km north-east
Henin-Lietard is over 70 km south

Graeme

[Soderbaum]

Hi Graeme

I have that Fonck did brought down an Alb D this day...so our sources differs....

Often the location of deaths in the Eberhardt/Zickerick loss list is not entirely correct, but could rather be nearest "German" town or similar.....

So I am still very interested if someone have the access to the combat report from Fonck this day and not from "his" book, which is merely "crap"...

:)
Gunnar

[Graeme]

Gunnar

Looking further, I've got a note that Jöns went down over Keyem/Keiem, about 6 Km north of Dixmuide. If this is correct then Fonck's victory is in the wrong area (regardless of being a scout or two-seater) and steers us back towards the claim made by Edwards, although his victim reportedly crashed ½ mile north of Dixmuide, rather than fell in flames.

Graeme